Pushing Parts to 107 Employees: How David May Built Trinity Precision | Ep 52

What's up guys? Sam McVey here with the What's up guys? Sam McVey here with the Killer Growth podcast and today I have Killer Growth podcast and today I have Killer Growth podcast and today I have David May uh owner and CEO of Trinity David May uh owner and CEO of Trinity David May uh owner and CEO of Trinity Precision and I'm not even going to try Precision and I'm not even going to try Precision and I'm not even going to try and pronounce it. and pronounce it. and pronounce it. » Tearats. Yeah. » Tearats. Yeah. » Tearats. Yeah. » Te aeratoss. » Te aeratoss. » Te aeratoss. » Aeratoss. Aeratas. I'm excited to » Aeratoss. Aeratas. I'm excited to » Aeratoss. Aeratas. I'm excited to understand that. understand that. understand that. » Yes. » Yes. » Yes. » Uh what goes behind that? It looks cool » Uh what goes behind that? It looks cool » Uh what goes behind that? It looks cool and I I do like the logo. But yeah, and I I do like the logo. But yeah, and I I do like the logo. But yeah, thanks for being here. thanks for being here. thanks for being here. » Yeah, thank you. We go back. I was » Yeah, thank you. We go back. I was » Yeah, thank you. We go back. I was trying to think of what year we met. Um, trying to think of what year we met. Um, trying to think of what year we met. Um, and how we met and why we met and I and how we met and why we met and I and how we met and why we met and I couldn't think of it. couldn't think of it. couldn't think of it. » No, I I gotta be honest. Um, I I would » No, I I gotta be honest. Um, I I would » No, I I gotta be honest. Um, I I would have a hard time as well. I sometimes my have a hard time as well. I sometimes my have a hard time as well. I sometimes my memory is is pretty faulty. So, memory is is pretty faulty. So, memory is is pretty faulty. So, » but it has been a while and always a » but it has been a while and always a » but it has been a while and always a pleasure. pleasure. pleasure. » No, I've always I knew your parents » No, I've always I knew your parents » No, I've always I knew your parents before you. before you. before you. » Uh, which was a pleasure working for » Uh, which was a pleasure working for » Uh, which was a pleasure working for them. We did a lot of rental cleanouts them. We did a lot of rental cleanouts them. We did a lot of rental cleanouts for them through good to be clean. for them through good to be clean. for them through good to be clean. » Oh, yeah. And then somehow I got » Oh, yeah. And then somehow I got » Oh, yeah. And then somehow I got connected to you and I cannot yeah think connected to you and I cannot yeah think connected to you and I cannot yeah think about it. But every time we got together about it. But every time we got together about it. But every time we got together for lunch, I always left and always for lunch, I always left and always for lunch, I always left and always thought I need to talk to David more. thought I need to talk to David more. thought I need to talk to David more. » Yeah, it's always a good » Yeah, it's always a good » Yeah, it's always a good conversation. So conversation. So conversation. So » um all right, well let's jump into it. » um all right, well let's jump into it. » um all right, well let's jump into it. And this is how I like to start it. Have And this is how I like to start it. Have And this is how I like to start it. Have you seen any episodes yet? you seen any episodes yet? you seen any episodes yet? » Yes, I have. » Yes, I have. » Yes, I have. » For have Okay, so you kind of get the » For have Okay, so you kind of get the » For have Okay, so you kind of get the vibe. It's really unprofessional and the vibe. It's really unprofessional and the vibe. It's really unprofessional and we just hang out and talk. we just hang out and talk. we just hang out and talk. » It feels very comfortable » It feels very comfortable » It feels very comfortable » about you. Good. Uh so yeah your » about you. Good. Uh so yeah your » about you. Good. Uh so yeah your background uh I mean you go back 25 background uh I mean you go back 25 background uh I mean you go back 25 years in the aero industry so uh let's years in the aero industry so uh let's years in the aero industry so uh let's just start theres just start theres just start theres where did David get into it and then where did David get into it and then where did David get into it and then what led him to Trinity and a keratas. what led him to Trinity and a keratas. what led him to Trinity and a keratas. » So I I wish there was some grand plan. » So I I wish there was some grand plan. » So I I wish there was some grand plan. I'm sure God's got that obviously in I'm sure God's got that obviously in I'm sure God's got that obviously in mind. I did not. Um when I came out of mind. I did not. Um when I came out of mind. I did not. Um when I came out of college, I was married, had a little one college, I was married, had a little one college, I was married, had a little one on the way, and so um had a connection on the way, and so um had a connection on the way, and so um had a connection out at um Cessna through an uncle who out at um Cessna through an uncle who out at um Cessna through an uncle who got me an interview. So I got my foot in got me an interview. So I got my foot in got me an interview. So I got my foot in the door. Um I started off probably as the door. Um I started off probably as the door. Um I started off probably as low as you can get in the supply chain low as you can get in the supply chain low as you can get in the supply chain world, which was pushing parts. So world, which was pushing parts. So world, which was pushing parts. So » what does that mean? Um, so we would » what does that mean? Um, so we would » what does that mean? Um, so we would like uh take any parts that production like uh take any parts that production like uh take any parts that production needed and we go out to the suppliers, needed and we go out to the suppliers, needed and we go out to the suppliers, we go coordinate and say, "Hey, how are we go coordinate and say, "Hey, how are we go coordinate and say, "Hey, how are you doing on delivery? Where are you at you doing on delivery? Where are you at you doing on delivery? Where are you at in the manufacturing process? You're in the manufacturing process? You're in the manufacturing process? You're late." You know, so it was a lot of late." You know, so it was a lot of late." You know, so it was a lot of conversations along those lines. conversations along those lines. conversations along those lines. » Um, and that was actually a really a » Um, and that was actually a really a » Um, and that was actually a really a great experience because I had great experience because I had great experience because I had interaction with production. I also had interaction with production. I also had interaction with production. I also had a lot of interaction with a lot of a lot of interaction with a lot of a lot of interaction with a lot of business owners, small businesses, some business owners, small businesses, some business owners, small businesses, some big businesses. Um, you learned how to big businesses. Um, you learned how to big businesses. Um, you learned how to have a good BS detector as well have a good BS detector as well have a good BS detector as well » pretty quickly because when people are » pretty quickly because when people are » pretty quickly because when people are late, they're not always as forthcoming late, they're not always as forthcoming late, they're not always as forthcoming as to what's going on. Um, so you as to what's going on. Um, so you as to what's going on. Um, so you quickly learned when and who to trust, quickly learned when and who to trust, quickly learned when and who to trust, which has served me really well. which has served me really well. which has served me really well. » Um, but after that was um in a program » Um, but after that was um in a program » Um, but after that was um in a program which they trained the um expediters to which they trained the um expediters to which they trained the um expediters to go into the buying positions. Then I go into the buying positions. Then I go into the buying positions. Then I joined a commodity team later on which joined a commodity team later on which joined a commodity team later on which was new at the time. a gentleman by the was new at the time. a gentleman by the was new at the time. a gentleman by the name of Mike Kazori um came in and name of Mike Kazori um came in and name of Mike Kazori um came in and really put together like crossf really put together like crossf really put together like crossf functional teams in supply chain. So we functional teams in supply chain. So we functional teams in supply chain. So we went all over North America saw over 200 went all over North America saw over 200 went all over North America saw over 200 different suppliers um all the way up different suppliers um all the way up different suppliers um all the way up like Honeywells, Rockwell Collins, Hexel like Honeywells, Rockwell Collins, Hexel like Honeywells, Rockwell Collins, Hexel like for composits to um literally went like for composits to um literally went like for composits to um literally went to a facility that was in a person's to a facility that was in a person's to a facility that was in a person's garage. garage. garage. » Um I stepped over a transmission, shoot » Um I stepped over a transmission, shoot » Um I stepped over a transmission, shoot away a couple of chickens. We had a away a couple of chickens. We had a away a couple of chickens. We had a great discussion at his, you know, great discussion at his, you know, great discussion at his, you know, dining room table. So, wonderful people. dining room table. So, wonderful people. dining room table. So, wonderful people. Park City was where they were at. Park City was where they were at. Park City was where they were at. » Park City. And what were they making? » Park City. And what were they making? » Park City. And what were they making? » Just small widgets, you know, kind of » Just small widgets, you know, kind of » Just small widgets, you know, kind of thing. Um, it wasn't I I would say that thing. Um, it wasn't I I would say that thing. Um, it wasn't I I would say that it wasn't as dialed in as supply chain it wasn't as dialed in as supply chain it wasn't as dialed in as supply chain is today, right? Okay. So, um, you know, is today, right? Okay. So, um, you know, is today, right? Okay. So, um, you know, again, this has been quite some time, again, this has been quite some time, again, this has been quite some time, but, um, it was the bottom line but, um, it was the bottom line but, um, it was the bottom line experience was to be able to see a lot experience was to be able to see a lot experience was to be able to see a lot of different businesses and I heard a of different businesses and I heard a of different businesses and I heard a lot of amazing stories about people that lot of amazing stories about people that lot of amazing stories about people that like started in their garage and built like started in their garage and built like started in their garage and built the business to, you know, this 50, the business to, you know, this 50, the business to, you know, this 50, 100,000 square foot building and they're 100,000 square foot building and they're 100,000 square foot building and they're doing all sorts of amazing things and doing all sorts of amazing things and doing all sorts of amazing things and » it just really » it just really » it just really » I'm sorry to get stuck on that specific » I'm sorry to get stuck on that specific » I'm sorry to get stuck on that specific garage story cuz that's fascinating to garage story cuz that's fascinating to garage story cuz that's fascinating to me. They did they invent a part or just me. They did they invent a part or just me. They did they invent a part or just get good at making a part and then found get good at making a part and then found get good at making a part and then found a client. a client. a client. » I So you as is with a lot of I think um » I So you as is with a lot of I think um » I So you as is with a lot of I think um startups for the machine world is startups for the machine world is startups for the machine world is usually there's somebody that has like usually there's somebody that has like usually there's somebody that has like machinist experience. machinist experience. machinist experience. » They go and they um buy a machine. » They go and they um buy a machine. » They go and they um buy a machine. They'll find either like a small They'll find either like a small They'll find either like a small building or they'll start up in the building or they'll start up in the building or they'll start up in the building, you know, by their house. Um, building, you know, by their house. Um, building, you know, by their house. Um, and then they'll just start making parts and then they'll just start making parts and then they'll just start making parts and because they have very little and because they have very little and because they have very little overhead, they've got some experience, overhead, they've got some experience, overhead, they've got some experience, » that's how they get their start, right? » that's how they get their start, right? » that's how they get their start, right? And then they work their way up in the And then they work their way up in the And then they work their way up in the in the food chain of complexity and, you in the food chain of complexity and, you in the food chain of complexity and, you know, just if they do a really great know, just if they do a really great know, just if they do a really great job. I've seen that so many times where job. I've seen that so many times where job. I've seen that so many times where somebody is working at a bigger company, somebody is working at a bigger company, somebody is working at a bigger company, they get the bug, they want to go out they get the bug, they want to go out they get the bug, they want to go out and do it on their own and so that's and do it on their own and so that's and do it on their own and so that's that's how they get started. So that's how they get started. So that's how they get started. So » that's cool. » that's cool. » that's cool. » Yeah. But there are definitely people » Yeah. But there are definitely people » Yeah. But there are definitely people that have um you know their own patent that have um you know their own patent that have um you know their own patent applications or they have their own applications or they have their own applications or they have their own particular niche and then that blows up particular niche and then that blows up particular niche and then that blows up into something really big and into something really big and into something really big and those are pretty cool stories too. Yeah. those are pretty cool stories too. Yeah. those are pretty cool stories too. Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » There's there's so much behind the » There's there's so much behind the » There's there's so much behind the aircraft industry that's going to be fun aircraft industry that's going to be fun aircraft industry that's going to be fun to talk about today that from the supply to talk about today that from the supply to talk about today that from the supply chain. I I there's a lot of different chain. I I there's a lot of different chain. I I there's a lot of different players. players. players. » Oh, there are » Oh, there are » Oh, there are » making a lot of different pieces and » making a lot of different pieces and » making a lot of different pieces and like how much does Boeing actually like how much does Boeing actually like how much does Boeing actually make and what they make is make and what they make is make and what they make is » what the you guys make and other » what the you guys make and other » what the you guys make and other providers is really interesting to me. providers is really interesting to me. providers is really interesting to me. Um but we'll continue with your story Um but we'll continue with your story Um but we'll continue with your story and we'll we'll get into that. and we'll we'll get into that. and we'll we'll get into that. » Yes. Um out of Textron I got the bug. » Yes. Um out of Textron I got the bug. » Yes. Um out of Textron I got the bug. Um, I knew that I didn't want to be uh Um, I knew that I didn't want to be uh Um, I knew that I didn't want to be uh in a large corporation. So, I'm not a in a large corporation. So, I'm not a in a large corporation. So, I'm not a big corporate guy, as I like to say. Um, big corporate guy, as I like to say. Um, big corporate guy, as I like to say. Um, really enjoy the breadth of business as really enjoy the breadth of business as really enjoy the breadth of business as opposed to the silos that are found in opposed to the silos that are found in opposed to the silos that are found in larger organizations. So, it would have larger organizations. So, it would have larger organizations. So, it would have taken me a long time to be able to get taken me a long time to be able to get taken me a long time to be able to get into other aspects besides supply chain into other aspects besides supply chain into other aspects besides supply chain um inside of uh inside of of that um inside of uh inside of of that um inside of uh inside of of that company and any large company to be company and any large company to be company and any large company to be honest. So they were great company to honest. So they were great company to honest. So they were great company to work for, really enjoyed it, but then work for, really enjoyed it, but then work for, really enjoyed it, but then left and went to um a smaller business left and went to um a smaller business left and went to um a smaller business where um you know had the opportunity at where um you know had the opportunity at where um you know had the opportunity at some point to start running the business some point to start running the business some point to start running the business for the private owner. Uh went for the private owner. Uh went for the private owner. Uh went through devestature, learned a lot from through devestature, learned a lot from through devestature, learned a lot from him » and you know went to private equity. So » and you know went to private equity. So » and you know went to private equity. So was a lot like um private ownership in was a lot like um private ownership in was a lot like um private ownership in terms of um you know focus. It did have terms of um you know focus. It did have terms of um you know focus. It did have a focus on the flip as like to say, you a focus on the flip as like to say, you a focus on the flip as like to say, you know, the liquidity horizon. They're know, the liquidity horizon. They're know, the liquidity horizon. They're always wanting to sell. Yeah. always wanting to sell. Yeah. always wanting to sell. Yeah. » Um and there were there was some more um » Um and there were there was some more um » Um and there were there was some more um rigidity around what I called corporate rigidity around what I called corporate rigidity around what I called corporate push-ups. So like the m monthly push-ups. So like the m monthly push-ups. So like the m monthly financial reporting, some of the sales financial reporting, some of the sales financial reporting, some of the sales cycles that we needed to do. So we went cycles that we needed to do. So we went cycles that we needed to do. So we went to like Farnboro, um the Pariser show to like Farnboro, um the Pariser show to like Farnboro, um the Pariser show kind of thing to you know be part of the kind of thing to you know be part of the kind of thing to you know be part of the overall corporate um for the for the PE overall corporate um for the for the PE overall corporate um for the for the PE group. So it was a bolt-on. Then they group. So it was a bolt-on. Then they group. So it was a bolt-on. Then they flipped to a publicly traded flipped to a publicly traded flipped to a publicly traded organization was a very large group that organization was a very large group that organization was a very large group that was not a good fit for me. was not a good fit for me. was not a good fit for me. » Um and for a variety of reasons um » Um and for a variety of reasons um » Um and for a variety of reasons um decided to exit uh and uh gave them as decided to exit uh and uh gave them as decided to exit uh and uh gave them as much time as they wanted because I much time as they wanted because I much time as they wanted because I really only had you know the thought really only had you know the thought really only had you know the thought process I want to go buy something and process I want to go buy something and process I want to go buy something and had a group of guys that wanted to go do had a group of guys that wanted to go do had a group of guys that wanted to go do that with right um in terms of being that with right um in terms of being that with right um in terms of being able to work together. Um I spent a year able to work together. Um I spent a year able to work together. Um I spent a year putting together an M&A deal. um took putting together an M&A deal. um took putting together an M&A deal. um took twice as long as I thought it was going twice as long as I thought it was going twice as long as I thought it was going to. Sure. to. Sure. to. Sure. » And so there was kind of a sbatical as I » And so there was kind of a sbatical as I » And so there was kind of a sbatical as I put it. I got a lot of great time with put it. I got a lot of great time with put it. I got a lot of great time with family. Um and then once we closed on family. Um and then once we closed on family. Um and then once we closed on the deal, we've been building Trinity the deal, we've been building Trinity the deal, we've been building Trinity ever since. ever since. ever since. » Um we spent uh all the way up into CO » Um we spent uh all the way up into CO » Um we spent uh all the way up into CO » and that's where a keratoss really came » and that's where a keratoss really came » and that's where a keratoss really came into play. Um during CO we tried very into play. Um during CO we tried very into play. Um during CO we tried very hard to make sure we maintained our hard to make sure we maintained our hard to make sure we maintained our workforce. So we literally used the workforce. So we literally used the workforce. So we literally used the triple P efforts to cut down trees, wipe triple P efforts to cut down trees, wipe triple P efforts to cut down trees, wipe down walls. We also did a lot around down walls. We also did a lot around down walls. We also did a lot around like automation like automation like automation » and a keratas was um » and a keratas was um » and a keratas was um » an outcropping of that automation » an outcropping of that automation » an outcropping of that automation effort. So in aerospace a lot of people effort. So in aerospace a lot of people effort. So in aerospace a lot of people think about automation in terms of hey think about automation in terms of hey think about automation in terms of hey I'm going to build this one thing I'm going to build this one thing I'm going to build this one thing » and I'm going to build um 10 20 100,000 » and I'm going to build um 10 20 100,000 » and I'm going to build um 10 20 100,000 of these every year right aerospace very of these every year right aerospace very of these every year right aerospace very rarely gets that volume. Usually you rarely gets that volume. Usually you rarely gets that volume. Usually you know you have somewhere between 30 to 40 know you have somewhere between 30 to 40 know you have somewhere between 30 to 40 ship sets or aircraft. So typically you ship sets or aircraft. So typically you ship sets or aircraft. So typically you have one part per aircraft and you're have one part per aircraft and you're have one part per aircraft and you're only making 30 or 40 of these a year. So only making 30 or 40 of these a year. So only making 30 or 40 of these a year. So what we did was we focused on how do we what we did was we focused on how do we what we did was we focused on how do we automate a process and then inside of automate a process and then inside of automate a process and then inside of that envelope we can produce any parts that envelope we can produce any parts that envelope we can produce any parts that fit that process and now it's no that fit that process and now it's no that fit that process and now it's no longer 30 or 40 of this one thing that longer 30 or 40 of this one thing that longer 30 or 40 of this one thing that we've automated but now we're automating we've automated but now we're automating we've automated but now we're automating thousands of parts and pieces that are thousands of parts and pieces that are thousands of parts and pieces that are going across it. if we can take the um going across it. if we can take the um going across it. if we can take the um high it's high mix low volume is what we high it's high mix low volume is what we high it's high mix low volume is what we call it. So this idea that we do a whole call it. So this idea that we do a whole call it. So this idea that we do a whole bunch of different parts but because bunch of different parts but because bunch of different parts but because they're the same process we don't have they're the same process we don't have they're the same process we don't have to have a lot of change over switch over to have a lot of change over switch over to have a lot of change over switch over same program same tooling and everything same program same tooling and everything same program same tooling and everything else. Um and that's where a keratas came else. Um and that's where a keratas came else. Um and that's where a keratas came into play. So, we had some really into play. So, we had some really into play. So, we had some really talented people said, "Hey, let's go talented people said, "Hey, let's go talented people said, "Hey, let's go build a business because how cool would build a business because how cool would build a business because how cool would it be to have, you know, all of this it be to have, you know, all of this it be to have, you know, all of this team at Trinity's disposal when we need team at Trinity's disposal when we need team at Trinity's disposal when we need it, but really be able to go sell that it, but really be able to go sell that it, but really be able to go sell that and create additional revenue um on and create additional revenue um on and create additional revenue um on other industries, other types of other industries, other types of other industries, other types of » other types of parts that you would » other types of parts that you would » other types of parts that you would build or consulting and helping other build or consulting and helping other build or consulting and helping other businesses do what you did." businesses do what you did." businesses do what you did." » So, it's kind of a mix of both, right? » So, it's kind of a mix of both, right? » So, it's kind of a mix of both, right? Um for Trinity, it's about how do we do Um for Trinity, it's about how do we do Um for Trinity, it's about how do we do it with other stuff? it with other stuff? it with other stuff? » Yeah. um for a keratas it's how do we » Yeah. um for a keratas it's how do we » Yeah. um for a keratas it's how do we automate other manufacturing processes automate other manufacturing processes automate other manufacturing processes so it's not just what they would call so it's not just what they would call so it's not just what they would call machine tending which is what Trinity is machine tending which is what Trinity is machine tending which is what Trinity is using but it's also how do we take and using but it's also how do we take and using but it's also how do we take and » you said machine » you said machine » you said machine » tending » tending » tending » yeah so literally um if you think about » yeah so literally um if you think about » yeah so literally um if you think about it it's the robot loading and unloading it it's the robot loading and unloading it it's the robot loading and unloading a part so we can load up it's 12 a part so we can load up it's 12 a part so we can load up it's 12 different infeed systems that or lanes different infeed systems that or lanes different infeed systems that or lanes where we either can load up 12 lanes of where we either can load up 12 lanes of where we either can load up 12 lanes of one part or 12 different parts and one part or 12 different parts and one part or 12 different parts and the robot will shift between each part the robot will shift between each part the robot will shift between each part and produce. So, we can literally go, and produce. So, we can literally go, and produce. So, we can literally go, you know, uh, close to 24 hours of you know, uh, close to 24 hours of you know, uh, close to 24 hours of unattended time. Now, there's a whole unattended time. Now, there's a whole unattended time. Now, there's a whole lot of stuff that goes into that and it lot of stuff that goes into that and it lot of stuff that goes into that and it sounds really easy, but and there's a sounds really easy, but and there's a sounds really easy, but and there's a lot of really small I Yeah, I lot of really small I Yeah, I lot of really small I Yeah, I » I'm not the technical guy, so it's » I'm not the technical guy, so it's » I'm not the technical guy, so it's really easy for me to say, "Oh, it's really easy for me to say, "Oh, it's really easy for me to say, "Oh, it's automation, right?" Yeah. automation, right?" Yeah. automation, right?" Yeah. » Um but you know there's so machine » Um but you know there's so machine » Um but you know there's so machine tending is all about taking the raw tending is all about taking the raw tending is all about taking the raw material loading in the machine and then material loading in the machine and then material loading in the machine and then bringing out a finished part and doing bringing out a finished part and doing bringing out a finished part and doing that over and over while people are that over and over while people are that over and over while people are doing like problem solving. They're not doing like problem solving. They're not doing like problem solving. They're not they're not loading the machine they're they're not loading the machine they're they're not loading the machine they're solving problems which is the whole solving problems which is the whole solving problems which is the whole intent of automation for us is not about intent of automation for us is not about intent of automation for us is not about replacing labor but it's about elevating replacing labor but it's about elevating replacing labor but it's about elevating and leveraging labor. Right? So just and leveraging labor. Right? So just and leveraging labor. Right? So just like um if you think about automation in like um if you think about automation in like um if you think about automation in terms of data, you know, a lot of where terms of data, you know, a lot of where terms of data, you know, a lot of where that's coming into play is being able to that's coming into play is being able to that's coming into play is being able to automate all the data entry, being able automate all the data entry, being able automate all the data entry, being able to automate all of the problem solving to automate all of the problem solving to automate all of the problem solving or the problem identification. So or the problem identification. So or the problem identification. So people then can go do a lot of the people then can go do a lot of the people then can go do a lot of the problem solving and that's where we put problem solving and that's where we put problem solving and that's where we put a lot of our data analytic efforts um a lot of our data analytic efforts um a lot of our data analytic efforts um into play as well at trending. Anyway, into play as well at trending. Anyway, into play as well at trending. Anyway, so a keratas will take and also automate so a keratas will take and also automate so a keratas will take and also automate like so we've done welding processes, like so we've done welding processes, like so we've done welding processes, we've done hydraulic forming processes, we've done hydraulic forming processes, we've done hydraulic forming processes, we've done um we've got quotes out there we've done um we've got quotes out there we've done um we've got quotes out there right now for some um um uh welding like right now for some um um uh welding like right now for some um um uh welding like on smaller components um some on smaller components um some on smaller components um some palletizing some of the food industry. palletizing some of the food industry. palletizing some of the food industry. So it's really tapping into a broader So it's really tapping into a broader So it's really tapping into a broader market than what aerospace is. And market than what aerospace is. And market than what aerospace is. And that's that's been really exciting that's that's been really exciting that's that's been really exciting seeing those businesses seeing those businesses seeing those businesses » Got it. and trying to build another » Got it. and trying to build another » Got it. and trying to build another business as well. business as well. business as well. » Got one question in the comments. » Got one question in the comments. » Got one question in the comments. » All right, let's hear this again. Uh » All right, let's hear this again. Uh » All right, let's hear this again. Uh they want to know, do you mostly work they want to know, do you mostly work they want to know, do you mostly work with private companies or also with private companies or also with private companies or also government projects? government projects? government projects? » Do you mostly work with private » Do you mostly work with private » Do you mostly work with private companies or just government? companies or just government? companies or just government? » Yeah. So for a keratas is uh primarily » Yeah. So for a keratas is uh primarily » Yeah. So for a keratas is uh primarily been private companies. Yeah, we haven't been private companies. Yeah, we haven't been private companies. Yeah, we haven't done any type of government work. Um done any type of government work. Um done any type of government work. Um with uh with Trinity, we do have some um with uh with Trinity, we do have some um with uh with Trinity, we do have some um defense work, but most of those are all defense work, but most of those are all defense work, but most of those are all through either publicly traded or or a through either publicly traded or or a through either publicly traded or or a private organization. So no direct DoD private organization. So no direct DoD private organization. So no direct DoD type work. Yep. type work. Yep. type work. Yep. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Uh so a Keratas when you're going out a » Uh so a Keratas when you're going out a » Uh so a Keratas when you're going out a keratas is a new brand essentially. keratas is a new brand essentially. keratas is a new brand essentially. Trinity is the backbone that still makes Trinity is the backbone that still makes Trinity is the backbone that still makes the product and Keratas is identifying the product and Keratas is identifying the product and Keratas is identifying other products to make other industries other products to make other industries other products to make other industries to help. to help. to help. » Uh yeah. Do they feed each other at all? » Uh yeah. Do they feed each other at all? » Uh yeah. Do they feed each other at all? » So support each other. Yes. Um feed each » So support each other. Yes. Um feed each » So support each other. Yes. Um feed each other. No. From the standpoint that a other. No. From the standpoint that a other. No. From the standpoint that a keratas is really a separate entity. keratas is really a separate entity. keratas is really a separate entity. » And so Trinity is still traditional » And so Trinity is still traditional » And so Trinity is still traditional machine and assembly type manufacturing machine and assembly type manufacturing machine and assembly type manufacturing for um the aerospace space and for um the aerospace space and for um the aerospace space and satellite. We're getting into drone satellite. We're getting into drone satellite. We're getting into drone market as well. But um Aeratoss is all market as well. But um Aeratoss is all market as well. But um Aeratoss is all about automation consulting. Got it. So about automation consulting. Got it. So about automation consulting. Got it. So it does not they don't they don't rely it does not they don't they don't rely it does not they don't they don't rely on each other in the traditional in that on each other in the traditional in that on each other in the traditional in that sense. sense. sense. » Yeah. Yeah. How how many of you guys » Yeah. Yeah. How how many of you guys » Yeah. Yeah. How how many of you guys make up a keratoss? make up a keratoss? make up a keratoss? » So there's um right now there are three » So there's um right now there are three » So there's um right now there are three full-time and then we've got uh three full-time and then we've got uh three full-time and then we've got uh three other support that feed in as well. other support that feed in as well. other support that feed in as well. » Interesting. And what year did that » Interesting. And what year did that » Interesting. And what year did that start? start? start? » Uh so that was uh right after co so 21. » Uh so that was uh right after co so 21. » Uh so that was uh right after co so 21. » 21. » 21. » 21. » Yeah. We really started getting serious » Yeah. We really started getting serious » Yeah. We really started getting serious about it um about uh 18 months ago. And about it um about uh 18 months ago. And about it um about uh 18 months ago. And um that's been it's been a lot of fun. um that's been it's been a lot of fun. um that's been it's been a lot of fun. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. » Yeah. In fact, we're just getting ready » Yeah. In fact, we're just getting ready » Yeah. In fact, we're just getting ready to um uh revamp our website. You know, to um uh revamp our website. You know, to um uh revamp our website. You know, as you kind of grow the business, Yeah. as you kind of grow the business, Yeah. as you kind of grow the business, Yeah. » you kind of outgrow what you're doing » you kind of outgrow what you're doing » you kind of outgrow what you're doing and so we're excited about that. and so we're excited about that. and so we're excited about that. » Yeah. That's awesome. » Yeah. That's awesome. » Yeah. That's awesome. » Um so, in the automation process, » Um so, in the automation process, » Um so, in the automation process, anybody that's doing any type of anybody that's doing any type of anybody that's doing any type of manufacturing is an ideal client for manufacturing is an ideal client for manufacturing is an ideal client for you. you. you. » Yeah, absolutely. » Yeah, absolutely. » Yeah, absolutely. » Across the board. » Across the board. » Across the board. » Yes. » Yes. » Yes. » Yeah. I bet that's fun, too. I mean, 20 » Yeah. I bet that's fun, too. I mean, 20 » Yeah. I bet that's fun, too. I mean, 20 I mean, how long have you been in the I mean, how long have you been in the I mean, how long have you been in the aerospace industry? aerospace industry? aerospace industry? » Long time. like 97 I think is what I » Long time. like 97 I think is what I » Long time. like 97 I think is what I found. found. found. » Um yeah, so you're about to hit 30 » Um yeah, so you're about to hit 30 » Um yeah, so you're about to hit 30 years. years. years. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » In the in the space. So that's that's » In the in the space. So that's that's » In the in the space. So that's that's probably fun to take that. I mean it's probably fun to take that. I mean it's probably fun to take that. I mean it's the same. It's not the same. It's very the same. It's not the same. It's very the same. It's not the same. It's very different. But the process of automating different. But the process of automating different. But the process of automating and manufacturing, and manufacturing, and manufacturing, right? If you need a part to look this right? If you need a part to look this right? If you need a part to look this way versus that and probably a lot of way versus that and probably a lot of way versus that and probably a lot of different material. How hard has that different material. How hard has that different material. How hard has that learning curve been? learning curve been? learning curve been? » You know, I I think the business side » You know, I I think the business side » You know, I I think the business side has been significantly different, right? has been significantly different, right? has been significantly different, right? So the sales cycle seems to be a little So the sales cycle seems to be a little So the sales cycle seems to be a little bit longer. Um what I have found bit longer. Um what I have found bit longer. Um what I have found interesting is uh the processes. You'd interesting is uh the processes. You'd interesting is uh the processes. You'd kind of think well business is business kind of think well business is business kind of think well business is business but just like when you're given the tour but just like when you're given the tour but just like when you're given the tour it was really interesting to to learn on it was really interesting to to learn on it was really interesting to to learn on the key things you're focused on with the key things you're focused on with the key things you're focused on with some of your business right. um you know some of your business right. um you know some of your business right. um you know with the automation group u we're with the automation group u we're with the automation group u we're learning how to filter early all the learning how to filter early all the learning how to filter early all the opportunities that we are getting in opportunities that we are getting in opportunities that we are getting in through like our pipeline right yeah through like our pipeline right yeah through like our pipeline right yeah » so um because while anybody that does » so um because while anybody that does » so um because while anybody that does manufacturing is a candidate for us to manufacturing is a candidate for us to manufacturing is a candidate for us to do business with they're not necessarily do business with they're not necessarily do business with they're not necessarily an ideal candidate because automation an ideal candidate because automation an ideal candidate because automation really takes a specific mindset really takes a specific mindset really takes a specific mindset » and if you think that you're going to go » and if you think that you're going to go » and if you think that you're going to go into automation, push a button, no into automation, push a button, no into automation, push a button, no problems ever, and walk away, you're problems ever, and walk away, you're problems ever, and walk away, you're probably not a best candidate to be able probably not a best candidate to be able probably not a best candidate to be able to work with on automation. You really to work with on automation. You really to work with on automation. You really need to be able to to hone down your need to be able to to hone down your need to be able to to hone down your process because automation is is an process because automation is is an process because automation is is an amplifier of process. amplifier of process. amplifier of process. » So, if you have bad processes, bad » So, if you have bad processes, bad » So, if you have bad processes, bad inputs, you're going to get bad results, inputs, you're going to get bad results, inputs, you're going to get bad results, right? No different than data. Um, and right? No different than data. Um, and right? No different than data. Um, and so it's really important that people are so it's really important that people are so it's really important that people are either willing to address their upstream either willing to address their upstream either willing to address their upstream automation issues or process issues that automation issues or process issues that automation issues or process issues that feed into the automation. Um, or they've feed into the automation. Um, or they've feed into the automation. Um, or they've already got a pretty salty already got a pretty salty already got a pretty salty process in place. process in place. process in place. » Yeah. So filtering through that's really » Yeah. So filtering through that's really » Yeah. So filtering through that's really important. important. important. » So you break down, someone comes in, » So you break down, someone comes in, » So you break down, someone comes in, someone's got to own that and then you someone's got to own that and then you someone's got to own that and then you have to understand their systems prior have to understand their systems prior have to understand their systems prior to working with you, right? like as far to working with you, right? like as far to working with you, right? like as far as what you're going to automate. How as what you're going to automate. How as what you're going to automate. How much uh hardware comes into that much uh hardware comes into that much uh hardware comes into that » are you like relying because I would » are you like relying because I would » are you like relying because I would think in the different industries the think in the different industries the think in the different industries the hardware also looks different as far as hardware also looks different as far as hardware also looks different as far as the tool the tools that are the tool the tools that are the tool the tools that are automated. automated. automated. » It does. Um, so a lot of their » It does. Um, so a lot of their » It does. Um, so a lot of their manufacturing process, we might not have manufacturing process, we might not have manufacturing process, we might not have anything to do with some of that anything to do with some of that anything to do with some of that hardware, right? What we would come into hardware, right? What we would come into hardware, right? What we would come into play is sensors, um, any kind of robotic play is sensors, um, any kind of robotic play is sensors, um, any kind of robotic systems. Maybe we come in with like a systems. Maybe we come in with like a systems. Maybe we come in with like a robotic arm, um, any camera or robotic arm, um, any camera or robotic arm, um, any camera or vision type systems, you know, things vision type systems, you know, things vision type systems, you know, things that are required to be able to do the that are required to be able to do the that are required to be able to do the automation piece of that manufacturing automation piece of that manufacturing automation piece of that manufacturing process. And we work with a variety of process. And we work with a variety of process. And we work with a variety of different like robotic providers. Um, we different like robotic providers. Um, we different like robotic providers. Um, we try to find the right support or mix for try to find the right support or mix for try to find the right support or mix for what's appropriate for what the customer what's appropriate for what the customer what's appropriate for what the customer wants. Um, there is a lot that wants. Um, there is a lot that wants. Um, there is a lot that goes into it and I, you know, I wish I goes into it and I, you know, I wish I goes into it and I, you know, I wish I could give a little bit better could give a little bit better could give a little bit better explanation, but we got some really explanation, but we got some really explanation, but we got some really smart people that we work with and I let smart people that we work with and I let smart people that we work with and I let them handle all that. them handle all that. them handle all that. » Yeah. Right. What's your role in a » Yeah. Right. What's your role in a » Yeah. Right. What's your role in a keratas? keratas? keratas? » Um, really it's just trying to help » Um, really it's just trying to help » Um, really it's just trying to help create uh the vision and the direction create uh the vision and the direction create uh the vision and the direction and then give some guide rails to the and then give some guide rails to the and then give some guide rails to the team. Um, so for example, and I just got team. Um, so for example, and I just got team. Um, so for example, and I just got back off of um some vacation time, but back off of um some vacation time, but back off of um some vacation time, but before we left, we um had a two-day before we left, we um had a two-day before we left, we um had a two-day process map, you know, uh event in which process map, you know, uh event in which process map, you know, uh event in which we went from cash or lead to cash, we went from cash or lead to cash, we went from cash or lead to cash, right? Okay. And at a high level, we right? Okay. And at a high level, we right? Okay. And at a high level, we identified um a variety of different identified um a variety of different identified um a variety of different things we need to go work on um how we things we need to go work on um how we things we need to go work on um how we can standardize some of those templates, can standardize some of those templates, can standardize some of those templates, but really trying to bring that but really trying to bring that but really trying to bring that strategic piece to the business and then strategic piece to the business and then strategic piece to the business and then start building the infrastructure that start building the infrastructure that start building the infrastructure that allows the business to grow uh you know allows the business to grow uh you know allows the business to grow uh you know outside of any particular individual or outside of any particular individual or outside of any particular individual or um definitely me. So I'm as I like to um definitely me. So I'm as I like to um definitely me. So I'm as I like to joke both at at Trinity and at Keratoss joke both at at Trinity and at Keratoss joke both at at Trinity and at Keratoss I'm the chief stay the way officer, I'm the chief stay the way officer, I'm the chief stay the way officer, right? So, I like that. right? So, I like that. right? So, I like that. » I want to make sure that I'm » I want to make sure that I'm » I want to make sure that I'm helping facilitate what I can. helping facilitate what I can. helping facilitate what I can. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Um and giving the team what they need, » Um and giving the team what they need, » Um and giving the team what they need, but really staying out of the way, but really staying out of the way, but really staying out of the way, but trying to also provide some guide rails, trying to also provide some guide rails, trying to also provide some guide rails, right? right? right? » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Um my position there both is has » Um my position there both is has » Um my position there both is has definitely changed specifically at definitely changed specifically at definitely changed specifically at Trinity, but really focusing more on you Trinity, but really focusing more on you Trinity, but really focusing more on you always hear that work more on the always hear that work more on the always hear that work more on the business as opposed to in the business. business as opposed to in the business. business as opposed to in the business. Y Y Y » and so I' I've been able to start making » and so I' I've been able to start making » and so I' I've been able to start making a lot of that transition and that's a lot of that transition and that's a lot of that transition and that's that's been a real blessing. that's been a real blessing. that's been a real blessing. » You're big on culture. I've been in your » You're big on culture. I've been in your » You're big on culture. I've been in your building, your cultures all over the building, your cultures all over the building, your cultures all over the walls. Uh talk about the three Ps and walls. Uh talk about the three Ps and walls. Uh talk about the three Ps and how you came to the three Ps. how you came to the three Ps. how you came to the three Ps. » Yeah. Uh people, process, and principle. » Yeah. Uh people, process, and principle. » Yeah. Uh people, process, and principle. So um the way we like to think of it is So um the way we like to think of it is So um the way we like to think of it is principle is is the foundational piece, principle is is the foundational piece, principle is is the foundational piece, right? So try to be faith-based is is um right? So try to be faith-based is is um right? So try to be faith-based is is um uh and have that rock and that uh and have that rock and that uh and have that rock and that foundation um that clarity of of purpose foundation um that clarity of of purpose foundation um that clarity of of purpose is the way we think of it. So when we is the way we think of it. So when we is the way we think of it. So when we think about our vision statement, it's think about our vision statement, it's think about our vision statement, it's the very first slide that we have with the very first slide that we have with the very first slide that we have with all of our customers. I think it throws all of our customers. I think it throws all of our customers. I think it throws everybody kind of for a loop. And in everybody kind of for a loop. And in everybody kind of for a loop. And in fact, I've had a I' I've had a couple fact, I've had a I' I've had a couple fact, I've had a I' I've had a couple questions on it early on, but now they questions on it early on, but now they questions on it early on, but now they kind of know us. Yeah. kind of know us. Yeah. kind of know us. Yeah. » Um but our first slide is it says um » Um but our first slide is it says um » Um but our first slide is it says um our vision is to change the world one our vision is to change the world one our vision is to change the world one relationship at a time guided by relationship at a time guided by relationship at a time guided by Christian principles. Right. And Christian principles. Right. And Christian principles. Right. And » so this idea from Mother Teresa that if » so this idea from Mother Teresa that if » so this idea from Mother Teresa that if you um want to change the world, don't you um want to change the world, don't you um want to change the world, don't go and try to change the world, you go and try to change the world, you go and try to change the world, you know, by going out and doing your know, by going out and doing your know, by going out and doing your thing, right? It's go home, love your thing, right? It's go home, love your thing, right? It's go home, love your family, change yourself, and that family, change yourself, and that family, change yourself, and that changes your family, which ripples out changes your family, which ripples out changes your family, which ripples out to your community, your community, the to your community, your community, the to your community, your community, the country, and the country, the world. So country, and the country, the world. So country, and the country, the world. So it's this idea that we we change our it's this idea that we we change our it's this idea that we we change our hearts and our minds first and then that hearts and our minds first and then that hearts and our minds first and then that allows our actions to have impacts that allows our actions to have impacts that allows our actions to have impacts that we don't understand or see. Right? So we don't understand or see. Right? So we don't understand or see. Right? So and that was really the main process and that was really the main process and that was really the main process or thought process behind why to get or thought process behind why to get or thought process behind why to get into business. I think if people just into business. I think if people just into business. I think if people just get into business to make money I think get into business to make money I think get into business to make money I think um one I think it's a little um one I think it's a little um one I think it's a little short-sighted short-sighted short-sighted » um you have to make profit in order to » um you have to make profit in order to » um you have to make profit in order to be successful, right? And be able to do be successful, right? And be able to do be successful, right? And be able to do the things you want. But I think there's the things you want. But I think there's the things you want. But I think there's a lot of other ways to go make money a lot of other ways to go make money a lot of other ways to go make money that's probably far easier than running that's probably far easier than running that's probably far easier than running an organization and for sure. an organization and for sure. an organization and for sure. » Amen. So, um, but it's this idea that, » Amen. So, um, but it's this idea that, » Amen. So, um, but it's this idea that, you know, we I think all get frustrated you know, we I think all get frustrated you know, we I think all get frustrated and it seems to be compounding and it seems to be compounding and it seems to be compounding regardless of your political bent, regardless of your political bent, regardless of your political bent, any kind of ideology, it doesn't matter. any kind of ideology, it doesn't matter. any kind of ideology, it doesn't matter. We just all have this innate sense that We just all have this innate sense that We just all have this innate sense that something's wrong. And and I've had it something's wrong. And and I've had it something's wrong. And and I've had it for a long time that I wanted to go have for a long time that I wanted to go have for a long time that I wanted to go have an impact or a change. And instead of an impact or a change. And instead of an impact or a change. And instead of thinking about it at a global level is thinking about it at a global level is thinking about it at a global level is really more of how do we do it inside of really more of how do we do it inside of really more of how do we do it inside of a business because if we can do it in a business because if we can do it in a business because if we can do it in our families and our business even in in our families and our business even in in our families and our business even in in an imperfect way because we're all an imperfect way because we're all an imperfect way because we're all imperfect people um but we can have a imperfect people um but we can have a imperfect people um but we can have a positive impact in all of their families positive impact in all of their families positive impact in all of their families and then those families on their you and then those families on their you and then those families on their you know their friends and all that. know their friends and all that. know their friends and all that. So um we decided that we would really So um we decided that we would really So um we decided that we would really put our effort and that's where the put our effort and that's where the put our effort and that's where the vision statement comes from. So that's vision statement comes from. So that's vision statement comes from. So that's that's the principle piece. that's the principle piece. that's the principle piece. » Yeah. people. I I don't care how » Yeah. people. I I don't care how » Yeah. people. I I don't care how automated we get, it it's still a people automated we get, it it's still a people automated we get, it it's still a people business. It's all about relationships. business. It's all about relationships. business. It's all about relationships. And so I think it's really And so I think it's really And so I think it's really important um to have a business where important um to have a business where important um to have a business where you have talented people that you trust. you have talented people that you trust. you have talented people that you trust. You're having a positive impact on them You're having a positive impact on them You're having a positive impact on them and then they're having a positive and then they're having a positive and then they're having a positive impact on the organization, the culture. impact on the organization, the culture. impact on the organization, the culture. Um and you just you take care of them. Um and you just you take care of them. Um and you just you take care of them. You do the best you can to take care of You do the best you can to take care of You do the best you can to take care of them. Again, we're all imperfect. We them. Again, we're all imperfect. We them. Again, we're all imperfect. We make mistakes. Um, and you're really make mistakes. Um, and you're really make mistakes. Um, and you're really looking for those individuals that want looking for those individuals that want looking for those individuals that want to learn, that will work through those to learn, that will work through those to learn, that will work through those mistakes. We focus on facts and process mistakes. We focus on facts and process mistakes. We focus on facts and process as opposed to, you know, is this is this as opposed to, you know, is this is this as opposed to, you know, is this is this person really um a competency issue. person really um a competency issue. person really um a competency issue. That's always the last thing that you That's always the last thing that you That's always the last thing that you want to ask because typically it's not. want to ask because typically it's not. want to ask because typically it's not. There's a lot of people that really want There's a lot of people that really want There's a lot of people that really want to try, but we don't give them the to try, but we don't give them the to try, but we don't give them the opportunity. Um, and then just how do we opportunity. Um, and then just how do we opportunity. Um, and then just how do we really take those people that are in a really take those people that are in a really take those people that are in a team and that's where the process comes team and that's where the process comes team and that's where the process comes into place and make sure that they're into place and make sure that they're into place and make sure that they're focused on a regular basis to be focused on a regular basis to be focused on a regular basis to be consistent performers. consistent performers. consistent performers. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Right. So we uh get that repeatability » Right. So we uh get that repeatability » Right. So we uh get that repeatability there. So that's where people process there. So that's where people process there. So that's where people process and principle come from. and principle come from. and principle come from. » Yeah, that's good. Uh the people » Yeah, that's good. Uh the people » Yeah, that's good. Uh the people part's the hardest part to me um across part's the hardest part to me um across part's the hardest part to me um across the board. And the principle part is the board. And the principle part is the board. And the principle part is obviously difficult. lays a foundation obviously difficult. lays a foundation obviously difficult. lays a foundation for how you want the people side to go. for how you want the people side to go. for how you want the people side to go. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Um building that out. But le let's talk » Um building that out. But le let's talk » Um building that out. But le let's talk about disclaiming that you're about disclaiming that you're about disclaiming that you're faith-based principles. H have you ever faith-based principles. H have you ever faith-based principles. H have you ever had any negative feedback in that loop? had any negative feedback in that loop? had any negative feedback in that loop? » I won't say first impressions. Um, so I » I won't say first impressions. Um, so I » I won't say first impressions. Um, so I had one customer who had a bad had one customer who had a bad had one customer who had a bad experience where every time this one experience where every time this one experience where every time this one particular supplier was pronouncing particular supplier was pronouncing particular supplier was pronouncing something um, in the media, their name something um, in the media, their name something um, in the media, their name got tied to that supplier because they got tied to that supplier because they got tied to that supplier because they were a prominent customer of that were a prominent customer of that were a prominent customer of that supplier. Um, and so they literally supplier. Um, and so they literally supplier. Um, and so they literally asked me, "So if you're Christian based, asked me, "So if you're Christian based, asked me, "So if you're Christian based, does that mean you only had you only does that mean you only had you only does that mean you only had you only have Christians that are working for have Christians that are working for have Christians that are working for you?" I I got to be honest with you, I you?" I I got to be honest with you, I you?" I I got to be honest with you, I have no idea. Number one, we have a have no idea. Number one, we have a have no idea. Number one, we have a third party. We're a PEO. So does a third party. We're a PEO. So does a third party. We're a PEO. So does a fantastic job of managing all of our fantastic job of managing all of our fantastic job of managing all of our team. They're really great at making team. They're really great at making team. They're really great at making sure that we're EEOC compliant. They sure that we're EEOC compliant. They sure that we're EEOC compliant. They they do all the right stuff, keep us in, they do all the right stuff, keep us in, they do all the right stuff, keep us in, you know, from a regulatory standpoint. you know, from a regulatory standpoint. you know, from a regulatory standpoint. They just are amazing. Um have had them They just are amazing. Um have had them They just are amazing. Um have had them since day one. since day one. since day one. » And the second thing is it's not what » And the second thing is it's not what » And the second thing is it's not what I'm about, right? I'm about, right? I'm about, right? » So it's um I really want to work and » So it's um I really want to work and » So it's um I really want to work and have an impact on on everybody as much have an impact on on everybody as much have an impact on on everybody as much as possible. Trinity as a whole has as possible. Trinity as a whole has as possible. Trinity as a whole has really embraced that culture and really embraced that culture and really embraced that culture and that mindset. Um, so I have no idea that mindset. Um, so I have no idea that mindset. Um, so I have no idea what other people believe unless they what other people believe unless they what other people believe unless they engage me into that discussion. And then engage me into that discussion. And then engage me into that discussion. And then you know it's always you always have an you know it's always you always have an you know it's always you always have an invitation but it's never you never win invitation but it's never you never win invitation but it's never you never win by trying to beat anything into by trying to beat anything into by trying to beat anything into anybody's head whether it be business, anybody's head whether it be business, anybody's head whether it be business, faith, kids, whatever. Right. So faith, kids, whatever. Right. So faith, kids, whatever. Right. So » um yeah. » um yeah. » um yeah. » Yeah. That's good. Yeah. uh the » Yeah. That's good. Yeah. uh the » Yeah. That's good. Yeah. uh the evangelistic side of the opportunity you evangelistic side of the opportunity you evangelistic side of the opportunity you could leverage in a business. I've seen could leverage in a business. I've seen could leverage in a business. I've seen that go bad. Uh and exactly how that go bad. Uh and exactly how that go bad. Uh and exactly how you've described it is the right way to you've described it is the right way to you've described it is the right way to do it, right? But I mean, if you're do it, right? But I mean, if you're do it, right? But I mean, if you're treating your business and treating your business and treating your business and employees like a church in a sense employees like a church in a sense employees like a church in a sense and accountability and requirements, and accountability and requirements, and accountability and requirements, that's a slippery slope of probably that's a slippery slope of probably that's a slippery slope of probably » Oh, yeah. » Oh, yeah. » Oh, yeah. » Oh, absolutely. » Oh, absolutely. » Oh, absolutely. » HR nightmare. Um but I love that. That's » HR nightmare. Um but I love that. That's » HR nightmare. Um but I love that. That's that's great. And I was more curious that's great. And I was more curious that's great. And I was more curious about actually putting Christian about actually putting Christian about actually putting Christian principle on the cover letter of principle on the cover letter of principle on the cover letter of everything you start with. Yeah. everything you start with. Yeah. everything you start with. Yeah. » Um I I don't feel like » Um I I don't feel like » Um I I don't feel like » I mean I I don't know very many people » I mean I I don't know very many people » I mean I I don't know very many people who disagree with those principles, who disagree with those principles, who disagree with those principles, right? Um there's there's certain if you right? Um there's there's certain if you right? Um there's there's certain if you get into the fine print, but the get into the fine print, but the get into the fine print, but the overarching bigger picture of it. Um I I overarching bigger picture of it. Um I I overarching bigger picture of it. Um I I could see you not really getting pushed could see you not really getting pushed could see you not really getting pushed back like, "Oh, okay. Yeah, they're just back like, "Oh, okay. Yeah, they're just back like, "Oh, okay. Yeah, they're just trying to be ethical and treat people trying to be ethical and treat people trying to be ethical and treat people right and be honest." And right and be honest." And right and be honest." And » yeah, I think there's a lot that serves » yeah, I think there's a lot that serves » yeah, I think there's a lot that serves us well in that. Um, yeah. I I also I us well in that. Um, yeah. I I also I us well in that. Um, yeah. I I also I believe the idea of and I think it I believe the idea of and I think it I believe the idea of and I think it I don't know if it's originally like a don't know if it's originally like a don't know if it's originally like a Dave Ramsey thing or not, but the more Dave Ramsey thing or not, but the more Dave Ramsey thing or not, but the more is caught than taught kind of is caught than taught kind of is caught than taught kind of » perspective, right? So, if we do the » perspective, right? So, if we do the » perspective, right? So, if we do the right things during difficult times, so right things during difficult times, so right things during difficult times, so for I'll give you two examples. Um, one for I'll give you two examples. Um, one for I'll give you two examples. Um, one is like we mentioned during COVID, we is like we mentioned during COVID, we is like we mentioned during COVID, we had one minor layoff. Most of the um, had one minor layoff. Most of the um, had one minor layoff. Most of the um, reduction we had in workforce because we reduction we had in workforce because we reduction we had in workforce because we lost over 50% of our revenue overnight. lost over 50% of our revenue overnight. lost over 50% of our revenue overnight. I mean, the commercial market tanked. I mean, the commercial market tanked. I mean, the commercial market tanked. Um, we it was it was a rough time, no Um, we it was it was a rough time, no Um, we it was it was a rough time, no doubt. doubt. doubt. » And had a lot of great people. Um, but » And had a lot of great people. Um, but » And had a lot of great people. Um, but we really wanted to try to protect the we really wanted to try to protect the we really wanted to try to protect the employee base because we knew it wasn't employee base because we knew it wasn't employee base because we knew it wasn't going to be forever, right? going to be forever, right? going to be forever, right? » We're going to need them. Now we're, you » We're going to need them. Now we're, you » We're going to need them. Now we're, you know, much larger than we ever were know, much larger than we ever were know, much larger than we ever were before. we've we've hit records for the before. we've we've hit records for the before. we've we've hit records for the company last two years. Um so we're company last two years. Um so we're company last two years. Um so we're really excited about that. Um and most really excited about that. Um and most really excited about that. Um and most of the people that were there through co of the people that were there through co of the people that were there through co are still with us. In fact, our um are still with us. In fact, our um are still with us. In fact, our um turnover rate is less than 10% in an turnover rate is less than 10% in an turnover rate is less than 10% in an industry that's closer to 30%. industry that's closer to 30%. industry that's closer to 30%. » Right on a 12-month basis. So we've got » Right on a 12-month basis. So we've got » Right on a 12-month basis. So we've got a tremendous amount of loyalty because a tremendous amount of loyalty because a tremendous amount of loyalty because the people work well together. They like the people work well together. They like the people work well together. They like being there and we try really hard to being there and we try really hard to being there and we try really hard to take care of them. Um we even gave take care of them. Um we even gave take care of them. Um we even gave bonuses and raises during that time. Uh bonuses and raises during that time. Uh bonuses and raises during that time. Uh the other thing that we've done is we've the other thing that we've done is we've the other thing that we've done is we've really worked to minimize the health really worked to minimize the health really worked to minimize the health care costs to our team. So for care costs to our team. So for care costs to our team. So for example, since day one, we have absorbed example, since day one, we have absorbed example, since day one, we have absorbed 100% of the increases that we have on 100% of the increases that we have on 100% of the increases that we have on our healthcare policy. We haven't our healthcare policy. We haven't our healthcare policy. We haven't changed. In fact, we actually have a changed. In fact, we actually have a changed. In fact, we actually have a richer policy than we started off with. richer policy than we started off with. richer policy than we started off with. So every penny of increase that we've So every penny of increase that we've So every penny of increase that we've had since 2014, we as a company have had since 2014, we as a company have had since 2014, we as a company have absorbed and the employees haven't seen absorbed and the employees haven't seen absorbed and the employees haven't seen any of it in their premiums. Wow. So any of it in their premiums. Wow. So any of it in their premiums. Wow. So they literally are paying for 2014 they literally are paying for 2014 they literally are paying for 2014 premiums. But I mean again it's it's premiums. But I mean again it's it's premiums. But I mean again it's it's taking care of those people first and taking care of those people first and taking care of those people first and having that heart to be able to having that heart to be able to having that heart to be able to really as a company and organization really as a company and organization really as a company and organization that's and I got to be clear that's not that's and I got to be clear that's not that's and I got to be clear that's not that's not me. That's the organization that's not me. That's the organization that's not me. That's the organization of the company. That's everybody you of the company. That's everybody you of the company. That's everybody you know working together doing the right know working together doing the right know working together doing the right things. And that's where the things. And that's where the things. And that's where the profitability comes in. You know you got profitability comes in. You know you got profitability comes in. You know you got to make sure you're profitable so you to make sure you're profitable so you to make sure you're profitable so you can go do those things and do you have a can go do those things and do you have a can go do those things and do you have a business that's successful. Um but it business that's successful. Um but it business that's successful. Um but it really is important that the culture is really is important that the culture is really is important that the culture is is built around that right so having is built around that right so having is built around that right so having that principle and that clarity of that principle and that clarity of that principle and that clarity of purpose becomes really important purpose becomes really important purpose becomes really important mostly in the difficult times but they mostly in the difficult times but they mostly in the difficult times but they also make those difficult times easier also make those difficult times easier also make those difficult times easier » because it's not like oh what do I do » because it's not like oh what do I do » because it's not like oh what do I do here well here well here well » if I want to be who I am » if I want to be who I am » if I want to be who I am » this is the path I go and I I trust in » this is the path I go and I I trust in » this is the path I go and I I trust in the good Lord to take care of everything the good Lord to take care of everything the good Lord to take care of everything so so so » yeah having a mission statement and » yeah having a mission statement and » yeah having a mission statement and something to fall back to in the hard something to fall back to in the hard something to fall back to in the hard times is so smart and honestly something times is so smart and honestly something times is so smart and honestly something I've been really bad at just like I've been really bad at just like I've been really bad at just like developing that. It's like, oh, we're developing that. It's like, oh, we're developing that. It's like, oh, we're going to we're going to be that way or going to we're going to be that way or going to we're going to be that way or that we already ooze this, right? You that we already ooze this, right? You that we already ooze this, right? You can kind of assume that you already can kind of assume that you already can kind of assume that you already create a culture and people do create a culture and people do create a culture and people do create cultures, you know, from their create cultures, you know, from their create cultures, you know, from their leadership perspective. But it is so leadership perspective. But it is so leadership perspective. But it is so important to have something like that important to have something like that important to have something like that essentially written down that like this essentially written down that like this essentially written down that like this is this is what we do. Uh this is who we is this is what we do. Uh this is who we is this is what we do. Uh this is who we are. And so when you're making any big are. And so when you're making any big are. And so when you're making any big decision to be able to go back to that decision to be able to go back to that decision to be able to go back to that those core mission statements that you those core mission statements that you those core mission statements that you guys are behind. Do you have you have uh guys are behind. Do you have you have uh guys are behind. Do you have you have uh people, principles, process, and then do people, principles, process, and then do people, principles, process, and then do you have a a larger mission statement? you have a a larger mission statement? you have a a larger mission statement? » So, the overall just the vision » So, the overall just the vision » So, the overall just the vision statement is really where we focus, statement is really where we focus, statement is really where we focus, right? And and we really enjoy building right? And and we really enjoy building right? And and we really enjoy building machine parts and assemblies. machine parts and assemblies. machine parts and assemblies. » So, um we just happen to be able to make » So, um we just happen to be able to make » So, um we just happen to be able to make widgets and be really good at it. widgets and be really good at it. widgets and be really good at it. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » We got a talented team to be able to go » We got a talented team to be able to go » We got a talented team to be able to go manage it. Um and now we're working on manage it. Um and now we're working on manage it. Um and now we're working on continuing that diversification process. continuing that diversification process. continuing that diversification process. So we try to make sure that we don't So we try to make sure that we don't So we try to make sure that we don't have any one platform, market or have any one platform, market or have any one platform, market or customer that is over a certain customer that is over a certain customer that is over a certain percentage. And as we've grown with percentage. And as we've grown with percentage. And as we've grown with certain customers, we're very grateful certain customers, we're very grateful certain customers, we're very grateful for them. Um we are now working to go for them. Um we are now working to go for them. Um we are now working to go get into newer customers, newer markets. get into newer customers, newer markets. get into newer customers, newer markets. The world's changing, you know, defense The world's changing, you know, defense The world's changing, you know, defense is changing quite a bit. Um even I think is changing quite a bit. Um even I think is changing quite a bit. Um even I think the commercial market will start to have the commercial market will start to have the commercial market will start to have some kind of changes around that as some kind of changes around that as some kind of changes around that as well. But um it's just been fun also well. But um it's just been fun also well. But um it's just been fun also having some new product coming through having some new product coming through having some new product coming through the door at at Trinity. So the door at at Trinity. So the door at at Trinity. So » how did you get good at robotics? Did » how did you get good at robotics? Did » how did you get good at robotics? Did you bring in a specialized person? If you bring in a specialized person? If you bring in a specialized person? If you're consulting on robotics, that's I you're consulting on robotics, that's I you're consulting on robotics, that's I mean » pretty deep understanding. » pretty deep understanding. » pretty deep understanding. » Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot to » Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot to » Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot to it. Um so I I would say there's two it. Um so I I would say there's two it. Um so I I would say there's two things that we did. Um, one of the things that we did. Um, one of the things that we did. Um, one of the one of the key guys, uh, Chris Vanover one of the key guys, uh, Chris Vanover one of the key guys, uh, Chris Vanover had a friend of his, um, by the name of had a friend of his, um, by the name of had a friend of his, um, by the name of Joel Cororali, who is a master was a Joel Cororali, who is a master was a Joel Cororali, who is a master was a master student. He's with us now, but at master student. He's with us now, but at master student. He's with us now, but at WSU, um, we wanted to get into WSU, um, we wanted to get into WSU, um, we wanted to get into automation. We bought a robotic cell automation. We bought a robotic cell automation. We bought a robotic cell that was already, you know, basically that was already, you know, basically that was already, you know, basically integrated into the machine. Um, so we integrated into the machine. Um, so we integrated into the machine. Um, so we bought a cookie cutter approach. decided bought a cookie cutter approach. decided bought a cookie cutter approach. decided very quickly that we didn't like that very quickly that we didn't like that very quickly that we didn't like that because every time we had a problem we because every time we had a problem we because every time we had a problem we were calling somebody up in Boston or were calling somebody up in Boston or were calling somebody up in Boston or some other place and it was very some other place and it was very some other place and it was very difficult to get it to do what we wanted difficult to get it to do what we wanted difficult to get it to do what we wanted it to do and plus it was all about one it to do and plus it was all about one it to do and plus it was all about one widget at a time high volume you know so widget at a time high volume you know so widget at a time high volume you know so we really had to find just that thing to we really had to find just that thing to we really had to find just that thing to put across it but it taught us robotics put across it but it taught us robotics put across it but it taught us robotics » and gave us the impetus to then say okay » and gave us the impetus to then say okay » and gave us the impetus to then say okay let's go build something that we want let's go build something that we want let's go build something that we want okay it's co got some downtime we went okay it's co got some downtime we went okay it's co got some downtime we went and bought a a cheaper machine um and bought a a cheaper machine um and bought a a cheaper machine um and put a robot in front of it. And we went put a robot in front of it. And we went put a robot in front of it. And we went through iteration after iteration after through iteration after iteration after through iteration after iteration after iteration. And the only skill that I had iteration. And the only skill that I had iteration. And the only skill that I had to have was the patience to be able to to have was the patience to be able to to have was the patience to be able to say, "Okay, we made a mistake. What are say, "Okay, we made a mistake. What are say, "Okay, we made a mistake. What are we learning from it?" And then the team we learning from it?" And then the team we learning from it?" And then the team would pick that up. And it was just it would pick that up. And it was just it would pick that up. And it was just it was honestly, it's really easy to look was honestly, it's really easy to look was honestly, it's really easy to look back now and say, "Oh, I'm so glad we back now and say, "Oh, I'm so glad we back now and say, "Oh, I'm so glad we did that." when we were going through it did that." when we were going through it did that." when we were going through it and here you have a machine and a robot and here you have a machine and a robot and here you have a machine and a robot and you're paying people and it's like and you're paying people and it's like and you're paying people and it's like it's really hard to have that patience it's really hard to have that patience it's really hard to have that patience but it's just yeah you just have faith but it's just yeah you just have faith but it's just yeah you just have faith that you know they're making progress that you know they're making progress that you know they're making progress and what they developed is literally and what they developed is literally and what they developed is literally amazing. everybody that comes in and amazing. everybody that comes in and amazing. everybody that comes in and sees it are like, "Wow, you guys have sees it are like, "Wow, you guys have sees it are like, "Wow, you guys have something special here, right?" And so something special here, right?" And so something special here, right?" And so that's also part of what helped us drive that's also part of what helped us drive that's also part of what helped us drive and say, "If we have a team that can do and say, "If we have a team that can do and say, "If we have a team that can do that with our process inside of that with our process inside of that with our process inside of aerospace, man, what can we do aerospace, man, what can we do aerospace, man, what can we do elsewhere?" You know, and that's the elsewhere?" You know, and that's the elsewhere?" You know, and that's the exciting piece is in fact, we've got one exciting piece is in fact, we've got one exciting piece is in fact, we've got one project that we completed um where one project that we completed um where one project that we completed um where it's fixtureless welding on eight it's fixtureless welding on eight it's fixtureless welding on eight different assemblies. So they do a different assemblies. So they do a different assemblies. So they do a changeover. Um there's four uh changeover. Um there's four uh changeover. Um there's four uh assemblies of the fairly the same and assemblies of the fairly the same and assemblies of the fairly the same and then another four set, but they're all then another four set, but they're all then another four set, but they're all without any kind of fixturing. They're without any kind of fixturing. They're without any kind of fixturing. They're all held um and assembled by it's all held um and assembled by it's all held um and assembled by it's three different robots. One's a welding three different robots. One's a welding three different robots. One's a welding robot, one's a fairly large industrial robot, one's a fairly large industrial robot, one's a fairly large industrial robot, another one's a UR collaborative. robot, another one's a UR collaborative. robot, another one's a UR collaborative. And they're doing And they're doing And they're doing » a UR collaborative. » a UR collaborative. » a UR collaborative. » So collaborative robot is so » So collaborative robot is so » So collaborative robot is so traditionally you'll see like the traditionally you'll see like the traditionally you'll see like the fencing or the laser lights around laser fencing or the laser lights around laser fencing or the laser lights around laser fencing around a robot. Um, it's because fencing around a robot. Um, it's because fencing around a robot. Um, it's because a robot traditionally is not going, it's a robot traditionally is not going, it's a robot traditionally is not going, it's just going to go through whatever it just going to go through whatever it just going to go through whatever it hits. Collaborative robots, UR is the hits. Collaborative robots, UR is the hits. Collaborative robots, UR is the brand. A collaborative robot has the brand. A collaborative robot has the brand. A collaborative robot has the ability to be able to sense when it ability to be able to sense when it ability to be able to sense when it collides. So, it doesn't move as fast. collides. So, it doesn't move as fast. collides. So, it doesn't move as fast. It's gives up a little bit on on the It's gives up a little bit on on the It's gives up a little bit on on the strength side, but you don't have any of strength side, but you don't have any of strength side, but you don't have any of the fencing. So, like all of our robots the fencing. So, like all of our robots the fencing. So, like all of our robots at Trinity are all collaborative. So, we at Trinity are all collaborative. So, we at Trinity are all collaborative. So, we are, are, are, » you know, right next to them. We're » you know, right next to them. We're » you know, right next to them. We're working with them when we need to, and working with them when we need to, and working with them when we need to, and we don't have to worry about safety in we don't have to worry about safety in we don't have to worry about safety in any way, shape, or form. Makes sense. any way, shape, or form. Makes sense. any way, shape, or form. Makes sense. » It's uh but um being able to watch the » It's uh but um being able to watch the » It's uh but um being able to watch the team do that is is just tremendous. It's team do that is is just tremendous. It's team do that is is just tremendous. It's a lot of fun. a lot of fun. a lot of fun. » So, and then the heavy Sorry, I'm » So, and then the heavy Sorry, I'm » So, and then the heavy Sorry, I'm getting into the weeds here, but I want getting into the weeds here, but I want getting into the weeds here, but I want to understand it. So, you have the to understand it. So, you have the to understand it. So, you have the welding robot and then the heavy welding robot and then the heavy welding robot and then the heavy industrial robots like holding the part. industrial robots like holding the part. industrial robots like holding the part. » Yeah. So, it there are points that it » Yeah. So, it there are points that it » Yeah. So, it there are points that it does. Um there is a base and it's got a does. Um there is a base and it's got a does. Um there is a base and it's got a a rotary on it, but they're setting a rotary on it, but they're setting a rotary on it, but they're setting everything on top of this base and then everything on top of this base and then everything on top of this base and then the heavy industrial robot is the heavy industrial robot is the heavy industrial robot is lifting the bigger pieces, right? the lifting the bigger pieces, right? the lifting the bigger pieces, right? the heavier pieces heavier pieces heavier pieces » and placing them and it will do holding » and placing them and it will do holding » and placing them and it will do holding where it tack welds um and then the where it tack welds um and then the where it tack welds um and then the collaborative robot will place some of collaborative robot will place some of collaborative robot will place some of the smaller pieces uh into that assembly the smaller pieces uh into that assembly the smaller pieces uh into that assembly and I don't remember how many details I and I don't remember how many details I and I don't remember how many details I want to say there's uh somewhere around want to say there's uh somewhere around want to say there's uh somewhere around eight or 10 pieces that go into that eight or 10 pieces that go into that eight or 10 pieces that go into that assembly and then it does a full weld um assembly and then it does a full weld um assembly and then it does a full weld um and the just an amazing project. So it and the just an amazing project. So it and the just an amazing project. So it was » and that's one part. So you have three » and that's one part. So you have three » and that's one part. So you have three robots they and then all the pieces are robots they and then all the pieces are robots they and then all the pieces are there then the parts done. What's there then the parts done. What's there then the parts done. What's the next step? Curious. next step? Curious. next step? Curious. » Oh well then for that particular cell it » Oh well then for that particular cell it » Oh well then for that particular cell it accomplishes what it's supposed to all accomplishes what it's supposed to all accomplishes what it's supposed to all the all the assembly and welding was the all the assembly and welding was the all the assembly and welding was done by hand before. Right. done by hand before. Right. done by hand before. Right. » Um and then they take and they will I I » Um and then they take and they will I I » Um and then they take and they will I I think that they do some uh painting some think that they do some uh painting some think that they do some uh painting some processing. processing. processing. » So like a human then removes the part. » So like a human then removes the part. » So like a human then removes the part. » It goes into an outfit like a big roller » It goes into an outfit like a big roller » It goes into an outfit like a big roller » piece. So then it's staged for somebody » piece. So then it's staged for somebody » piece. So then it's staged for somebody to pick it up and go from there. to pick it up and go from there. to pick it up and go from there. » And then those parts are essentially » And then those parts are essentially » And then those parts are essentially stacked and then it starts the next one stacked and then it starts the next one stacked and then it starts the next one » pretty much and they load the parts each » pretty much and they load the parts each » pretty much and they load the parts each time. time. time. » No, no, they have they have a infeed » No, no, they have they have a infeed » No, no, they have they have a infeed cart that has all of the components that cart that has all of the components that cart that has all of the components that go to it and the robots literally pick go to it and the robots literally pick go to it and the robots literally pick it up off the cart. it up off the cart. it up off the cart. » Wow. » Wow. » Wow. » Puts in assembles them together, tax » Puts in assembles them together, tax » Puts in assembles them together, tax welds it up and goes on from there. welds it up and goes on from there. welds it up and goes on from there. And it it really is amazing. And what's And it it really is amazing. And what's And it it really is amazing. And what's interesting about that is that it could interesting about that is that it could interesting about that is that it could be so diverse that you're if it's just be so diverse that you're if it's just be so diverse that you're if it's just grabbing it off a cart. grabbing it off a cart. grabbing it off a cart. I mean, theoretically, you could say I mean, theoretically, you could say I mean, theoretically, you could say that system is going to weld 10 that system is going to weld 10 that system is going to weld 10 completely different things today. completely different things today. completely different things today. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » If they can program them in where you're » If they can program them in where you're » If they can program them in where you're not like you not set up a system that not like you not set up a system that not like you not set up a system that only makes that part like traditional only makes that part like traditional only makes that part like traditional automation, right? You build an automation, right? You build an automation, right? You build an automation that can only make the one automation that can only make the one automation that can only make the one thing. Robotics, I'm assuming it thing. Robotics, I'm assuming it thing. Robotics, I'm assuming it diversifies that. diversifies that. diversifies that. » It it definitely helps. Now, so we have » It it definitely helps. Now, so we have » It it definitely helps. Now, so we have a bit of a different approach than a bit of a different approach than a bit of a different approach than probably most what they call probably most what they call probably most what they call integrators, which is what a keratas is. integrators, which is what a keratas is. integrators, which is what a keratas is. » It's an integrator taking manu or » It's an integrator taking manu or » It's an integrator taking manu or automation uh hardware doing the automation uh hardware doing the automation uh hardware doing the engineering design and then plugging engineering design and then plugging engineering design and then plugging that into the manufacturing process, that into the manufacturing process, that into the manufacturing process, right? Um so we take a little bit of a right? Um so we take a little bit of a right? Um so we take a little bit of a backwards approach. Instead of saying, backwards approach. Instead of saying, backwards approach. Instead of saying, "Oh yeah, hey, I've got this uh robot. I "Oh yeah, hey, I've got this uh robot. I "Oh yeah, hey, I've got this uh robot. I want to sell you the robot and so want to sell you the robot and so want to sell you the robot and so therefore this is what we need you to do therefore this is what we need you to do therefore this is what we need you to do in your manufacturing process." in your manufacturing process." in your manufacturing process." We come in and say, "What do you want to We come in and say, "What do you want to We come in and say, "What do you want to accomplish with your manufacturing accomplish with your manufacturing accomplish with your manufacturing process?" And then we work on doing the process?" And then we work on doing the process?" And then we work on doing the customized kind of a boutique customized kind of a boutique customized kind of a boutique engineering effort to come in and say, engineering effort to come in and say, engineering effort to come in and say, "This is what we would recommend. You "This is what we would recommend. You "This is what we would recommend. You might have some upstream problems that might have some upstream problems that might have some upstream problems that we need to address, but here's how we we need to address, but here's how we we need to address, but here's how we can go and significantly improve and can go and significantly improve and can go and significantly improve and provide you a fantastic ROI for your provide you a fantastic ROI for your provide you a fantastic ROI for your investment and also give you the investment and also give you the investment and also give you the repeatability of the process, the repeatability of the process, the repeatability of the process, the consistency of your runtime. You know, consistency of your runtime. You know, consistency of your runtime. You know, you don't have to worry about whether you don't have to worry about whether you don't have to worry about whether people are going to be coming in your people are going to be coming in your people are going to be coming in your hiring issues because a lot of people hiring issues because a lot of people hiring issues because a lot of people are doing automation because they're are doing automation because they're are doing automation because they're having a hard time finding skilled having a hard time finding skilled having a hard time finding skilled labor, a team. And so automation again, labor, a team. And so automation again, labor, a team. And so automation again, it's not about replacing the person to it's not about replacing the person to it's not about replacing the person to produce the product. It's about produce the product. It's about produce the product. It's about leveraging the person's ability. So leveraging the person's ability. So leveraging the person's ability. So instead of I mean for us, we're running instead of I mean for us, we're running instead of I mean for us, we're running somewhere between, you know, three plus somewhere between, you know, three plus somewhere between, you know, three plus machines of robots with one person and machines of robots with one person and machines of robots with one person and able to leverage all of all of their able to leverage all of all of their able to leverage all of all of their talent in order to be able to um to be talent in order to be able to um to be talent in order to be able to um to be able to produce more, right? able to produce more, right? able to produce more, right? » Yeah. So yeah, that makes sense. So the » Yeah. So yeah, that makes sense. So the » Yeah. So yeah, that makes sense. So the traditional model you work backwards traditional model you work backwards traditional model you work backwards from it. So if I were to build a robot, from it. So if I were to build a robot, from it. So if I were to build a robot, I identify a market need, right? So a I identify a market need, right? So a I identify a market need, right? So a demand signal is everybody's making this demand signal is everybody's making this demand signal is everybody's making this part all over the country. There's 100 part all over the country. There's 100 part all over the country. There's 100 businesses, 100 Trinity precisions businesses, 100 Trinity precisions businesses, 100 Trinity precisions making this single part. making this single part. making this single part. » So I'm going to build a robot that » So I'm going to build a robot that » So I'm going to build a robot that automates that because I know they're automates that because I know they're automates that because I know they're all using humans still to make that. all using humans still to make that. all using humans still to make that. That would be a off-the-shelf product That would be a off-the-shelf product That would be a off-the-shelf product that you could develop and then go sell that you could develop and then go sell that you could develop and then go sell a robot. You guys are coming at it from a robot. You guys are coming at it from a robot. You guys are coming at it from a different because that's where my a different because that's where my a different because that's where my head would go. Traditionally in head would go. Traditionally in head would go. Traditionally in business, I'd be like, "Oh, we should business, I'd be like, "Oh, we should business, I'd be like, "Oh, we should just identify what's the one thing they just identify what's the one thing they just identify what's the one thing they make the most of make the most of make the most of » and then build a offtheshelf out of the » and then build a offtheshelf out of the » and then build a offtheshelf out of the box like here you go." Yeah. box like here you go." Yeah. box like here you go." Yeah. » Right. And I'm assuming like you said if » Right. And I'm assuming like you said if » Right. And I'm assuming like you said if there's only 35 parts a year or 40 for there's only 35 parts a year or 40 for there's only 35 parts a year or 40 for like and that's specific to aerospace, like and that's specific to aerospace, like and that's specific to aerospace, right? Um, but do you do you see right? Um, but do you do you see right? Um, but do you do you see opportunities where something off the opportunities where something off the opportunities where something off the shelf makes more sense than shelf makes more sense than shelf makes more sense than » Yeah, I would I would agree with that. » Yeah, I would I would agree with that. » Yeah, I would I would agree with that. Um, if it's something that's fairly Um, if it's something that's fairly Um, if it's something that's fairly simple. simple. simple. » Um, even with that though, there is a » Um, even with that though, there is a » Um, even with that though, there is a lot of it's not as simple as like taking lot of it's not as simple as like taking lot of it's not as simple as like taking a Mindstorm, plugging it into a a Mindstorm, plugging it into a a Mindstorm, plugging it into a particular, you know, um, process and particular, you know, um, process and particular, you know, um, process and then it's just going to automatically then it's just going to automatically then it's just going to automatically work, right? work, right? work, right? » Sure. So part of the magic also has to » Sure. So part of the magic also has to » Sure. So part of the magic also has to be how do we define and work through be how do we define and work through be how do we define and work through that manufacturing process to make sure that manufacturing process to make sure that manufacturing process to make sure that we're accomplishing what we want in that we're accomplishing what we want in that we're accomplishing what we want in a consistent way. So for example, a consistent way. So for example, a consistent way. So for example, machine tending um there are so many machine tending um there are so many machine tending um there are so many things that happen on the machine side things that happen on the machine side things that happen on the machine side that are not just related to the robot that are not just related to the robot that are not just related to the robot and the feed infeed system, the placing and the feed infeed system, the placing and the feed infeed system, the placing of the part. You know, there could be of the part. You know, there could be of the part. You know, there could be chips, there could be broken cutters, chips, there could be broken cutters, chips, there could be broken cutters, there could be wrong geometry, sometimes there could be wrong geometry, sometimes there could be wrong geometry, sometimes the material that comes in is slightly the material that comes in is slightly the material that comes in is slightly off, so we're doing some probing. Um off, so we're doing some probing. Um off, so we're doing some probing. Um there's just a lot that goes into there's just a lot that goes into there's just a lot that goes into » um any kind of process, right? And I » um any kind of process, right? And I » um any kind of process, right? And I think that's where I get most of my think that's where I get most of my think that's where I get most of my excitement is there's always something excitement is there's always something excitement is there's always something new. I mean, so for example, again, new. I mean, so for example, again, new. I mean, so for example, again, going back to the tour you gave, which going back to the tour you gave, which going back to the tour you gave, which was fantastic. Thank you. Um, you have a was fantastic. Thank you. Um, you have a was fantastic. Thank you. Um, you have a lot of ideas, don't you? lot of ideas, don't you? lot of ideas, don't you? » Well, I mean, it would be love to talk » Well, I mean, it would be love to talk » Well, I mean, it would be love to talk to you about it, but for to you about it, but for to you about it, but for clarification, I g I give all of my clarification, I g I give all of my clarification, I g I give all of my guests a tour of the book operation. We guests a tour of the book operation. We guests a tour of the book operation. We scan and list thousands of books online scan and list thousands of books online scan and list thousands of books online in this building, and we happen to have in this building, and we happen to have in this building, and we happen to have a podcast studio in the corner. That's a podcast studio in the corner. That's a podcast studio in the corner. That's it's very cool. it's very cool. it's very cool. » Continue. » Continue. » Continue. » But you know, you think about, oh, » But you know, you think about, oh, » But you know, you think about, oh, you're you're selling books, man. There you're you're selling books, man. There you're you're selling books, man. There is is is » so much that is behind that, right? » so much that is behind that, right? » so much that is behind that, right? Right. Right. Right. » And I think any business, anything » And I think any business, anything » And I think any business, anything that anybody is doing, any kind of that anybody is doing, any kind of that anybody is doing, any kind of venture, you always see kind of the venture, you always see kind of the venture, you always see kind of the surface and then it's like you pull back surface and then it's like you pull back surface and then it's like you pull back the veneer or veil or whatever you want the veneer or veil or whatever you want the veneer or veil or whatever you want to call it. And there is a lot of depth to call it. And there is a lot of depth to call it. And there is a lot of depth there even in the smallest of businesses there even in the smallest of businesses there even in the smallest of businesses where people are juggling so many where people are juggling so many where people are juggling so many different aspects that people from the different aspects that people from the different aspects that people from the outside » they don't have any idea at all. » they don't have any idea at all. » they don't have any idea at all. » Well yeah it's like a conveyor right. So » Well yeah it's like a conveyor right. So » Well yeah it's like a conveyor right. So in the book processing our biggest in the book processing our biggest in the book processing our biggest inefficiency is a person grabbing a book inefficiency is a person grabbing a book inefficiency is a person grabbing a book out of a big box scanning it seeing what out of a big box scanning it seeing what out of a big box scanning it seeing what that says then sorting it right. So they that says then sorting it right. So they that says then sorting it right. So they have conveyors for that system. Robotic have conveyors for that system. Robotic have conveyors for that system. Robotic conveyors with arms that swing out. it conveyors with arms that swing out. it conveyors with arms that swing out. it scans. The negative uh is our space and scans. The negative uh is our space and scans. The negative uh is our space and how it's designed and the only things how it's designed and the only things how it's designed and the only things that are out there and how they're made that are out there and how they're made that are out there and how they're made with our space is a problem. with our space is a problem. with our space is a problem. » Right. » Right. » Right. » Kind of back to your point like there » Kind of back to your point like there » Kind of back to your point like there and then the second part of that is and then the second part of that is and then the second part of that is there's these two other parts to a book. there's these two other parts to a book. there's these two other parts to a book. None of them can scan and that's where None of them can scan and that's where None of them can scan and that's where we make most of our profit. So ISBN's we make most of our profit. So ISBN's we make most of our profit. So ISBN's and title searches when it doesn't have and title searches when it doesn't have and title searches when it doesn't have a barcode that turns into a whole a barcode that turns into a whole a barcode that turns into a whole lookup. uh we've messed with some AI for lookup. uh we've messed with some AI for lookup. uh we've messed with some AI for some different parts of that and I think some different parts of that and I think some different parts of that and I think that'll automate eventually but it's not that'll automate eventually but it's not that'll automate eventually but it's not tied into any of the systems yet. So tied into any of the systems yet. So tied into any of the systems yet. So what we have in our head of automation, what we have in our head of automation, what we have in our head of automation, which would be a blast to talk to you which would be a blast to talk to you which would be a blast to talk to you about is like it doesn't exist, right? about is like it doesn't exist, right? about is like it doesn't exist, right? Like and it's kind of duct tape probably Like and it's kind of duct tape probably Like and it's kind of duct tape probably needs to be a blend of a couple needs to be a blend of a couple needs to be a blend of a couple different systems to fully automate it. different systems to fully automate it. different systems to fully automate it. Yep. Yep. Yep. » Uh going forward, but that's to » Uh going forward, but that's to » Uh going forward, but that's to your point of the depth and uh yeah, your point of the depth and uh yeah, your point of the depth and uh yeah, opening unveiling the curtain like opening unveiling the curtain like opening unveiling the curtain like there's all these other things that there's all these other things that there's all these other things that someone would come in and say, "Oh, just someone would come in and say, "Oh, just someone would come in and say, "Oh, just get a conveyor in this." Like, "Yeah, get a conveyor in this." Like, "Yeah, get a conveyor in this." Like, "Yeah, but » yeah, this is what goes into » yeah, this is what goes into » yeah, this is what goes into » here's all the other things that we're » here's all the other things that we're » here's all the other things that we're dealing with." Um, dealing with." Um, dealing with." Um, » but yeah, that's great. That's » but yeah, that's great. That's » but yeah, that's great. That's fascinating. Uh, so what does I'm fascinating. Uh, so what does I'm fascinating. Uh, so what does I'm curious about cost? Throw throw out some curious about cost? Throw throw out some curious about cost? Throw throw out some ballpark numbers. They don't have to be ballpark numbers. They don't have to be ballpark numbers. They don't have to be spot on. Specifically, like those three spot on. Specifically, like those three spot on. Specifically, like those three robots for that one part you just talked robots for that one part you just talked robots for that one part you just talked about, what is the capital uh how much about, what is the capital uh how much about, what is the capital uh how much capital to buy those three robots? capital to buy those three robots? capital to buy those three robots? » Yes. It depending on the complexity that » Yes. It depending on the complexity that » Yes. It depending on the complexity that goes into it and the hardware that's goes into it and the hardware that's goes into it and the hardware that's available, right? So um your robots can available, right? So um your robots can available, right? So um your robots can cost um well, let's put like this. your cost um well, let's put like this. your cost um well, let's put like this. your projects are going to range somewhere projects are going to range somewhere projects are going to range somewhere between probably 150,000 to you can get between probably 150,000 to you can get between probably 150,000 to you can get up to 3/4 of a million dollars, right? up to 3/4 of a million dollars, right? up to 3/4 of a million dollars, right? » Um we've done some larger quotes for » Um we've done some larger quotes for » Um we've done some larger quotes for more complex processes. more complex processes. more complex processes. » Um and it just really kind of depends on » Um and it just really kind of depends on » Um and it just really kind of depends on what's out there and what's out there and what's out there and what they're asking us to do. So, so part of they're asking us to do. So, so part of they're asking us to do. So, so part of this is having um some detective work up this is having um some detective work up this is having um some detective work up front where you're saying here's the front where you're saying here's the front where you're saying here's the statement of work that we're developing statement of work that we're developing statement of work that we're developing and what you're asking us to do so we and what you're asking us to do so we and what you're asking us to do so we have clarity on what you want from us so have clarity on what you want from us so have clarity on what you want from us so we have a clear deliverable for our we have a clear deliverable for our we have a clear deliverable for our customer right customer right customer right » which would be part of that is for all » which would be part of that is for all » which would be part of that is for all the hardware part of it is also the hardware part of it is also the hardware part of it is also performance of that hardware and all of performance of that hardware and all of performance of that hardware and all of the engineering that goes into it so the engineering that goes into it so the engineering that goes into it so kind of like a consulting kind of like a consulting kind of like a consulting type arrangement as well. type arrangement as well. type arrangement as well. » Like the heavy I I was thinking of even » Like the heavy I I was thinking of even » Like the heavy I I was thinking of even just like the heavy just the hardware just like the heavy just the hardware just like the heavy just the hardware piece itself that specific industrial piece itself that specific industrial piece itself that specific industrial heavy robot because I've seen those on heavy robot because I've seen those on heavy robot because I've seen those on lots of you know just these different lots of you know just these different lots of you know just these different robot arms that are wild what they can robot arms that are wild what they can robot arms that are wild what they can pick up and relocate. I was just curious pick up and relocate. I was just curious pick up and relocate. I was just curious like what is I mean I don't even know like what is I mean I don't even know like what is I mean I don't even know where you would get that and I'm sure where you would get that and I'm sure where you would get that and I'm sure sometimes they're custom. It's like oh sometimes they're custom. It's like oh sometimes they're custom. It's like oh you need this weight. Oh we're that'll you need this weight. Oh we're that'll you need this weight. Oh we're that'll be in the production line soon. Are be in the production line soon. Are be in the production line soon. Are those just inventoried? they're just those just inventoried? they're just those just inventoried? they're just sitting on a shelf somewhere, sitting on a shelf somewhere, sitting on a shelf somewhere, » you know. There some of them are um » you know. There some of them are um » you know. There some of them are um but most are not. Most are, you know, but most are not. Most are, you know, but most are not. Most are, you know, they've got a pipeline that's coming in, they've got a pipeline that's coming in, they've got a pipeline that's coming in, they'll sell serial numbers, you know, they'll sell serial numbers, you know, they'll sell serial numbers, you know, and um so you might not get it right and um so you might not get it right and um so you might not get it right away. Um but a lot of them you can away. Um but a lot of them you can away. Um but a lot of them you can either buy, so we deal directly with either buy, so we deal directly with either buy, so we deal directly with some of the robot manufacturers some of the robot manufacturers some of the robot manufacturers themselves. We also have some great themselves. We also have some great themselves. We also have some great partners that are distributors and all partners that are distributors and all partners that are distributors and all they do is sell the hardware, but they do is sell the hardware, but they do is sell the hardware, but they don't necessarily do the engineering or don't necessarily do the engineering or don't necessarily do the engineering or they don't do the integration they don't do the integration they don't do the integration installation. So, we've got some great installation. So, we've got some great installation. So, we've got some great relationships there. Um, but really a relationships there. Um, but really a relationships there. Um, but really a lot of it is um building the lot of it is um building the lot of it is um building the relationship primarily with the customer relationship primarily with the customer relationship primarily with the customer base first and then we've got the base first and then we've got the base first and then we've got the relationship with the hardware providers relationship with the hardware providers relationship with the hardware providers and OEMs. and OEMs. and OEMs. » By the way, I finally get what you do. » By the way, I finally get what you do. » By the way, I finally get what you do. So, that was helpful. We got there. So, that was helpful. We got there. So, that was helpful. We got there. That's always my main goal. like when I That's always my main goal. like when I That's always my main goal. like when I fully like I finally see the whole fully like I finally see the whole fully like I finally see the whole picture of a keratas. But that's picture of a keratas. But that's picture of a keratas. But that's awesome. That's like really cool. That awesome. That's like really cool. That awesome. That's like really cool. That would be fun. would be fun. would be fun. » It is. » It is. » It is. » I mean, especially with the right team » I mean, especially with the right team » I mean, especially with the right team going in and just Yeah, it probably going in and just Yeah, it probably going in and just Yeah, it probably blows people's minds, too, when it gets blows people's minds, too, when it gets blows people's minds, too, when it gets there. Like when it gets close to there. Like when it gets close to there. Like when it gets close to finish. finish. finish. » I'm sure a lot of people are standing » I'm sure a lot of people are standing » I'm sure a lot of people are standing around like, "Oh, I I have to be honest. around like, "Oh, I I have to be honest. around like, "Oh, I I have to be honest. I am guilty of and I know um I can think I am guilty of and I know um I can think I am guilty of and I know um I can think of a couple people specifically that of a couple people specifically that of a couple people specifically that every time they see me come around like every time they see me come around like every time they see me come around like the robots they're like oh gosh here he the robots they're like oh gosh here he the robots they're like oh gosh here he comes again but I can just stand there comes again but I can just stand there comes again but I can just stand there and watch the robots just operate and watch the robots just operate and watch the robots just operate and maybe it's because I love the I love the maybe it's because I love the I love the maybe it's because I love the I love the » David » David » David got my cup of coffee and I can I can got my cup of coffee and I can I can got my cup of coffee and I can I can stand there for a little while. So, um, stand there for a little while. So, um, stand there for a little while. So, um, but it it really is and part of it but it it really is and part of it but it it really is and part of it is just kind of that sense of wonder and is just kind of that sense of wonder and is just kind of that sense of wonder and awe » in terms of, wow, look at what a bunch » in terms of, wow, look at what a bunch » in terms of, wow, look at what a bunch of smart people cuz, you know, if you of smart people cuz, you know, if you of smart people cuz, you know, if you really break it down, I I I I wonder really break it down, I I I I wonder really break it down, I I I I wonder about the same thing with like CNC about the same thing with like CNC about the same thing with like CNC manufacturing, right? So, let's just manufacturing, right? So, let's just manufacturing, right? So, let's just take and say our infeed outfeed system. take and say our infeed outfeed system. take and say our infeed outfeed system. I know there are a lot of people that I know there are a lot of people that I know there are a lot of people that had input at Trinity with a keratoss to had input at Trinity with a keratoss to had input at Trinity with a keratoss to go develop that system. Then you think go develop that system. Then you think go develop that system. Then you think about all the people that have the about all the people that have the about all the people that have the patents, designs for all the things that patents, designs for all the things that patents, designs for all the things that go into the robot and then the gripper go into the robot and then the gripper go into the robot and then the gripper and then the CNC machine. I mean there and then the CNC machine. I mean there and then the CNC machine. I mean there are there are so many people that work are there are so many people that work are there are so many people that work together and this is where I mean when together and this is where I mean when together and this is where I mean when we start talking about like people we start talking about like people we start talking about like people coming out of, you know, not being coming out of, you know, not being coming out of, you know, not being important in business because we're important in business because we're important in business because we're automating everything. I think that so automating everything. I think that so automating everything. I think that so misses the boat. I really do. But you misses the boat. I really do. But you misses the boat. I really do. But you just, you know, we build on the just, you know, we build on the just, you know, we build on the innovation of people that were before us innovation of people that were before us innovation of people that were before us and the people that are around us. And and the people that are around us. And and the people that are around us. And it's just such a beautiful thing. I it's just such a beautiful thing. I it's just such a beautiful thing. I think it's really neat. think it's really neat. think it's really neat. » Yeah. The layers of innovation to your » Yeah. The layers of innovation to your » Yeah. The layers of innovation to your finished project is cool. I mean, the finished project is cool. I mean, the finished project is cool. I mean, the final end cuz Yeah. If the CNC if final end cuz Yeah. If the CNC if final end cuz Yeah. If the CNC if the parts are coming in and that CNC is the parts are coming in and that CNC is the parts are coming in and that CNC is not consistent enough, I would have not consistent enough, I would have not consistent enough, I would have never thought about that. never thought about that. never thought about that. » Yeah. like CNC's cutting all the metal » Yeah. like CNC's cutting all the metal » Yeah. like CNC's cutting all the metal pieces potentially depending on what pieces potentially depending on what pieces potentially depending on what they're making. Then they come over and they're making. Then they come over and they're making. Then they come over and if that thing's off then how is this if that thing's off then how is this if that thing's off then how is this going to adjust? How's your three robots going to adjust? How's your three robots going to adjust? How's your three robots that weld it all together? that weld it all together? that weld it all together? » That's exactly » That's exactly » That's exactly » how do they adjust like that? Yeah. I » how do they adjust like that? Yeah. I » how do they adjust like that? Yeah. I would never would never would never » That's why there's experts. » That's why there's experts. » That's why there's experts. » You can produce a lot of scrap very » You can produce a lot of scrap very » You can produce a lot of scrap very quickly if you don't have a good quickly if you don't have a good quickly if you don't have a good process. process. process. » Yeah. No doubt. » Yeah. No doubt. » Yeah. No doubt. » No doubt. » No doubt. » No doubt. » Yeah. That's that's wild. Uh who's your » Yeah. That's that's wild. Uh who's your » Yeah. That's that's wild. Uh who's your core customer right now since 20 for a core customer right now since 20 for a core customer right now since 20 for a keratas? keratas? keratas? specifically industry. I'm curious why specifically industry. I'm curious why specifically industry. I'm curious why the industry you've helped the most the industry you've helped the most the industry you've helped the most since 21. since 21. since 21. » Wow, that's a a a great question. Um, » Wow, that's a a a great question. Um, » Wow, that's a a a great question. Um, » you know, I I don't know if I could give » you know, I I don't know if I could give » you know, I I don't know if I could give you a straight answer because we've gone you a straight answer because we've gone you a straight answer because we've gone from food industry to um bulk conveyor from food industry to um bulk conveyor from food industry to um bulk conveyor systems to systems to systems to uh actually they're like pressure valves uh actually they're like pressure valves uh actually they're like pressure valves that break at a certain pressure. that break at a certain pressure. that break at a certain pressure. They've got a patent, a very just an They've got a patent, a very just an They've got a patent, a very just an amazing business. We've helped them. amazing business. We've helped them. amazing business. We've helped them. We've helped um some wire manufacturers. We've helped um some wire manufacturers. We've helped um some wire manufacturers. Uh we helped a plastic manufacturer that Uh we helped a plastic manufacturer that Uh we helped a plastic manufacturer that is doing like u window sills, door is doing like u window sills, door is doing like u window sills, door frames, things like that. So we were frames, things like that. So we were frames, things like that. So we were helped them with an automation project. helped them with an automation project. helped them with an automation project. Obviously Trinity is um a part of that Obviously Trinity is um a part of that Obviously Trinity is um a part of that as well. We've done some other machine as well. We've done some other machine as well. We've done some other machine tending um in and I don't even remember tending um in and I don't even remember tending um in and I don't even remember what industries they were in but making what industries they were in but making what industries they were in but making different types of u machine components different types of u machine components different types of u machine components that are not there were some type of that are not there were some type of that are not there were some type of commercial application. So, um, it's commercial application. So, um, it's commercial application. So, um, it's really pretty diverse. And, yeah, again, really pretty diverse. And, yeah, again, really pretty diverse. And, yeah, again, that's I love that. I'm I'm kind of a that's I love that. I'm I'm kind of a that's I love that. I'm I'm kind of a shiny object kind of guy. I'm great at shiny object kind of guy. I'm great at shiny object kind of guy. I'm great at getting something started. I'm really getting something started. I'm really getting something started. I'm really bad about getting something finished. bad about getting something finished. bad about getting something finished. So, I got to partner with people that So, I got to partner with people that So, I got to partner with people that are great. are great. are great. » I can't relate at all. That must be » I can't relate at all. That must be » I can't relate at all. That must be tough. That'd be tough to be you, David. tough. That'd be tough to be you, David. tough. That'd be tough to be you, David. » It Yeah, it it's especially on the home » It Yeah, it it's especially on the home » It Yeah, it it's especially on the home front when I don't get it done, front when I don't get it done, front when I don't get it done, » right? » right? » right? » And my wife is a saint. She's very » And my wife is a saint. She's very » And my wife is a saint. She's very patient with me. So on that note, patient with me. So on that note, patient with me. So on that note, bouncing business and now you're you've bouncing business and now you're you've bouncing business and now you're you've started this uh where do you spend started this uh where do you spend started this uh where do you spend your most of your time, Trinity or your most of your time, Trinity or your most of your time, Trinity or Keratas? Keratas? Keratas? » Uh so I'm really blessed with a a very » Uh so I'm really blessed with a a very » Uh so I'm really blessed with a a very strong team at Trinity. Uh last year we strong team at Trinity. Uh last year we strong team at Trinity. Uh last year we put a gentleman by the name of Chris put a gentleman by the name of Chris put a gentleman by the name of Chris Vanover who's one of the founding four Vanover who's one of the founding four Vanover who's one of the founding four with me Dave Tyson and Steve Ford. with me Dave Tyson and Steve Ford. with me Dave Tyson and Steve Ford. Um and he is the GM now over at Trinity Um and he is the GM now over at Trinity Um and he is the GM now over at Trinity which has allowed me to do two things. which has allowed me to do two things. which has allowed me to do two things. one shift my focus and spend about half one shift my focus and spend about half one shift my focus and spend about half my time at a keratas um along with my time at a keratas um along with my time at a keratas um along with Trinity and then also be able to really Trinity and then also be able to really Trinity and then also be able to really when I'm spending time at Trinity I'm when I'm spending time at Trinity I'm when I'm spending time at Trinity I'm trying very hard not to get into the trying very hard not to get into the trying very hard not to get into the weeds » and really focused on strategy » and really focused on strategy » and really focused on strategy guidelines you know here's kind of the guidelines you know here's kind of the guidelines you know here's kind of the guide rails that we want to operate guide rails that we want to operate guide rails that we want to operate within um and just give some overall within um and just give some overall within um and just give some overall direction and it I think that's that's direction and it I think that's that's direction and it I think that's that's been really hard I'm gonna be honest um been really hard I'm gonna be honest um been really hard I'm gonna be honest um and I I kind of talked to him a little and I I kind of talked to him a little and I I kind of talked to him a little bit about it bit about it bit about it You know, it's really hard as is when You know, it's really hard as is when You know, it's really hard as is when you're used to being in the thick of you're used to being in the thick of you're used to being in the thick of things, right? Um, and this is where I things, right? Um, and this is where I things, right? Um, and this is where I just thank God that I've got a lot of just thank God that I've got a lot of just thank God that I've got a lot of great people that I trust. But to be great people that I trust. But to be great people that I trust. But to be able to step back and say, "Okay, I just able to step back and say, "Okay, I just able to step back and say, "Okay, I just need to be able to say, okay, this is need to be able to say, okay, this is need to be able to say, okay, this is where we need to go. You guys are where we need to go. You guys are where we need to go. You guys are completely great at doing this, and nine completely great at doing this, and nine completely great at doing this, and nine times out of 10, you were doing it times out of 10, you were doing it times out of 10, you were doing it anyway. I just need to get out of that anyway. I just need to get out of that anyway. I just need to get out of that tenth time and really let people go tenth time and really let people go tenth time and really let people go handle it." um where most of my time at handle it." um where most of my time at handle it." um where most of my time at Trinity has been both strategy and Trinity has been both strategy and Trinity has been both strategy and really focusing on um fleshing out and really focusing on um fleshing out and really focusing on um fleshing out and building out that uh metric building out that uh metric building out that uh metric infrastructure that helps give us that infrastructure that helps give us that infrastructure that helps give us that guiding you know direction guiding you know direction guiding you know direction » um from an analytic standpoint. So we » um from an analytic standpoint. So we » um from an analytic standpoint. So we really start converting everything over really start converting everything over really start converting everything over to Microsoft PowerBI. Um we've got a to Microsoft PowerBI. Um we've got a to Microsoft PowerBI. Um we've got a great business systems analytics um great business systems analytics um great business systems analytics um manager who h handles all the business manager who h handles all the business manager who h handles all the business system stuff. Um and he's done some system stuff. Um and he's done some system stuff. Um and he's done some amazing things but we're converting it amazing things but we're converting it amazing things but we're converting it all to PowerBI and uh that has been all to PowerBI and uh that has been all to PowerBI and uh that has been amazing. So amazing. So amazing. So » is it I I'm not familiar with that. Is » is it I I'm not familiar with that. Is » is it I I'm not familiar with that. Is it just like a CRM or project management it just like a CRM or project management it just like a CRM or project management tool or uh tool or uh tool or uh » so PowerBI is just data analytics. So, » so PowerBI is just data analytics. So, » so PowerBI is just data analytics. So, we've got we've plugged it into our CRM we've got we've plugged it into our CRM we've got we've plugged it into our CRM uh our ERP really is what it is, which uh our ERP really is what it is, which uh our ERP really is what it is, which is all of the um where all the data is all of the um where all the data is all of the um where all the data resides, how we move jobs, how we resides, how we move jobs, how we resides, how we move jobs, how we manage, but it's it's how we can quickly manage, but it's it's how we can quickly manage, but it's it's how we can quickly slice and dice information and it's slice and dice information and it's slice and dice information and it's always present. It's live data. So, you always present. It's live data. So, you always present. It's live data. So, you know, whereas we'd have to go back and know, whereas we'd have to go back and know, whereas we'd have to go back and rerun reports, we might have to dump rerun reports, we might have to dump rerun reports, we might have to dump them into Excel or Access, I want to them into Excel or Access, I want to them into Excel or Access, I want to look at it like this. we can play with look at it like this. we can play with look at it like this. we can play with the data live. Cool. the data live. Cool. the data live. Cool. » And really building that infrastructure » And really building that infrastructure » And really building that infrastructure that gives us very fast data um and puts that gives us very fast data um and puts that gives us very fast data um and puts it at our fingertips. So now we're it at our fingertips. So now we're it at our fingertips. So now we're focused and continue to focus more on focused and continue to focus more on focused and continue to focus more on problem solving or identification problem solving or identification problem solving or identification um by using those tools. So we don't um by using those tools. So we don't um by using those tools. So we don't have it completely throughout each one have it completely throughout each one have it completely throughout each one of our departments. We've been kind of of our departments. We've been kind of of our departments. We've been kind of taking it a chunk at a time, but uh what taking it a chunk at a time, but uh what taking it a chunk at a time, but uh what we've been able to build out so far is we've been able to build out so far is we've been able to build out so far is just it it really has been gamechanging just it it really has been gamechanging just it it really has been gamechanging for us. How many people work at Trinity for us. How many people work at Trinity for us. How many people work at Trinity Precision? Precision? Precision? » So 107 now. » So 107 now. » So 107 now. » Wow. » Wow. » Wow. » Yeah. We started off at 32. » Yeah. We started off at 32. » Yeah. We started off at 32. » So it's been an amazing journey. » So it's been an amazing journey. » So it's been an amazing journey. God's been good. That's all I can say. God's been good. That's all I can say. God's been good. That's all I can say. God's been good. God's been good. God's been good. » Uh talk about that. Uh at Keratas, I » Uh talk about that. Uh at Keratas, I » Uh talk about that. Uh at Keratas, I don't know if there's any traveling don't know if there's any traveling don't know if there's any traveling involved or you get to do most of it involved or you get to do most of it involved or you get to do most of it remote. Um what I mean it sounds like remote. Um what I mean it sounds like remote. Um what I mean it sounds like these things are all over the place. these things are all over the place. these things are all over the place. » They are. So we try to keep it within um » They are. So we try to keep it within um » They are. So we try to keep it within um about a 5 to six hour radius from drive about a 5 to six hour radius from drive about a 5 to six hour radius from drive time. Um, I don't do a lot of the time. Um, I don't do a lot of the time. Um, I don't do a lot of the traveling anymore. I've done my fair traveling anymore. I've done my fair traveling anymore. I've done my fair share. Um, I really like being at home share. Um, I really like being at home share. Um, I really like being at home to be honest with you. I'm kind of a to be honest with you. I'm kind of a to be honest with you. I'm kind of a home bunny. Um, and so the but the team home bunny. Um, and so the but the team home bunny. Um, and so the but the team has been uh fantastic. They we we do try has been uh fantastic. They we we do try has been uh fantastic. They we we do try to make sure that we are not keeping to make sure that we are not keeping to make sure that we are not keeping people on the road all the time. That is people on the road all the time. That is people on the road all the time. That is I am very sensitive to that because I I am very sensitive to that because I I am very sensitive to that because I remember when and it was one of the remember when and it was one of the remember when and it was one of the honestly one of the drivers for me also honestly one of the drivers for me also honestly one of the drivers for me also in a big company was uh when I was at u in a big company was uh when I was at u in a big company was uh when I was at u at uh my first job I was on the road at at uh my first job I was on the road at at uh my first job I was on the road at least two weeks out of every month least two weeks out of every month least two weeks out of every month » and we had you know two daughters I had » and we had you know two daughters I had » and we had you know two daughters I had um third child on the way before I left um third child on the way before I left um third child on the way before I left and which my oldest son and which my oldest son and which my oldest son » um and it just it just wasn't great for » um and it just it just wasn't great for » um and it just it just wasn't great for any of us and so uh that was a big any of us and so uh that was a big any of us and so uh that was a big driver for me. I still had to do some driver for me. I still had to do some driver for me. I still had to do some traveling, but I was a little bit more traveling, but I was a little bit more traveling, but I was a little bit more in control of when and what. Um, not all in control of when and what. Um, not all in control of when and what. Um, not all the time, but most of the time. And then the time, but most of the time. And then the time, but most of the time. And then now I've I've got the privilege not now I've I've got the privilege not now I've I've got the privilege not to do any of that. So, it's been that's to do any of that. So, it's been that's to do any of that. So, it's been that's been a blessing. been a blessing. been a blessing. » How many kids do you have now? » How many kids do you have now? » How many kids do you have now? » Seven. » Seven. » Seven. » Seven. » Seven. » Seven. » Yep. » Yep. » Yep. » I think I knew you had seven. I was just » I think I knew you had seven. I was just » I think I knew you had seven. I was just making sure there wasn't another one. making sure there wasn't another one. making sure there wasn't another one. » Nope. » Nope. » Nope. » That's awesome. Uh, live out live out on » That's awesome. Uh, live out live out on » That's awesome. Uh, live out live out on some land, right? some land, right? some land, right? » Yeah. On the country and Yeah. seven » Yeah. On the country and Yeah. seven » Yeah. On the country and Yeah. seven kids. That's You've always I've always kids. That's You've always I've always kids. That's You've always I've always been impressed how detailed and focused been impressed how detailed and focused been impressed how detailed and focused and some of our talks about your family. and some of our talks about your family. and some of our talks about your family. You're you're obsessed with your family. You're you're obsessed with your family. You're you're obsessed with your family. How how have you been able to take a How how have you been able to take a How how have you been able to take a company from 30 employees to 100 company from 30 employees to 100 company from 30 employees to 100 employees and build this and still feel employees and build this and still feel employees and build this and still feel like you've got balance on your core like you've got balance on your core like you've got balance on your core foundation of your family. foundation of your family. foundation of your family. » I I have to be honest um I don't always » I I have to be honest um I don't always » I I have to be honest um I don't always feel like I do to be and I think feel like I do to be and I think feel like I do to be and I think » I think I try um to be sensitive. This » I think I try um to be sensitive. This » I think I try um to be sensitive. This is an area where um sometimes I do is an area where um sometimes I do is an area where um sometimes I do really great and then other times I'm really great and then other times I'm really great and then other times I'm not so great. And um I would, you know, not so great. And um I would, you know, not so great. And um I would, you know, just say that uh I'm I'm blessed to have just say that uh I'm I'm blessed to have just say that uh I'm I'm blessed to have just a a saint of a wife. I think I just a a saint of a wife. I think I just a a saint of a wife. I think I mentioned that before, but um she really mentioned that before, but um she really mentioned that before, but um she really is amazing. Um so she's been very is amazing. Um so she's been very is amazing. Um so she's been very supportive all along. We've had some supportive all along. We've had some supportive all along. We've had some goals as to, you know, what we'd goals as to, you know, what we'd goals as to, you know, what we'd like to be able to do. Um, but the other like to be able to do. Um, but the other like to be able to do. Um, but the other thing is you really have to build out a thing is you really have to build out a thing is you really have to build out a great team, you know. Um, and I think great team, you know. Um, and I think great team, you know. Um, and I think that you have to do that if you want to that you have to do that if you want to that you have to do that if you want to get past and I don't remember if it's get past and I don't remember if it's get past and I don't remember if it's good to great that has it in there, but good to great that has it in there, but good to great that has it in there, but talking about no man's land, right? So, talking about no man's land, right? So, talking about no man's land, right? So, kind of between the size of business kind of between the size of business kind of between the size of business where an individual can touch every where an individual can touch every where an individual can touch every process, control every process, and process, control every process, and process, control every process, and really they're not doing it, but they're really they're not doing it, but they're really they're not doing it, but they're they have their eyes on everything, they have their eyes on everything, they have their eyes on everything, right? to there. You start outgrowing right? to there. You start outgrowing right? to there. You start outgrowing that ability and either you're going to that ability and either you're going to that ability and either you're going to becoming the limiting factor becoming the limiting factor becoming the limiting factor » where now the business can't grow past » where now the business can't grow past » where now the business can't grow past your inability to be able to go manage your inability to be able to go manage your inability to be able to go manage it it it » or you're really focused on the people » or you're really focused on the people » or you're really focused on the people and the processes, right? And you have and the processes, right? And you have and the processes, right? And you have the data to tell you we're doing well or the data to tell you we're doing well or the data to tell you we're doing well or we're not. we're not. we're not. » Um, and you're stepping out of the way. » Um, and you're stepping out of the way. » Um, and you're stepping out of the way. You're saying this is the vision. This You're saying this is the vision. This You're saying this is the vision. This is the direction. This is what we as a is the direction. This is what we as a is the direction. This is what we as a team decide that we want to go do. And team decide that we want to go do. And team decide that we want to go do. And you're staying out of the way. Um, and you're staying out of the way. Um, and you're staying out of the way. Um, and so that's really I think that is true so that's really I think that is true so that's really I think that is true also when you, you know, are trying to also when you, you know, are trying to also when you, you know, are trying to balance between the family time and the balance between the family time and the balance between the family time and the work time, you really got to be able to work time, you really got to be able to work time, you really got to be able to flesh that out because it if all you're flesh that out because it if all you're flesh that out because it if all you're doing is you're the only one that's doing is you're the only one that's doing is you're the only one that's making all the decisions, doing making all the decisions, doing making all the decisions, doing everything, it's going to consume you. everything, it's going to consume you. everything, it's going to consume you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. » Right. And especially the bigger it » Right. And especially the bigger it » Right. And especially the bigger it gets, the harder it is to put any time gets, the harder it is to put any time gets, the harder it is to put any time towards family whatsoever. So, um, towards family whatsoever. So, um, towards family whatsoever. So, um, that'd be my piece of advice. that'd be my piece of advice. that'd be my piece of advice. » Yeah. No, that's really good. Great » Yeah. No, that's really good. Great » Yeah. No, that's really good. Great answer on the wife side. I I would answer on the wife side. I I would answer on the wife side. I I would agree. I've been in situations where agree. I've been in situations where agree. I've been in situations where couples were not on the same page. couples were not on the same page. couples were not on the same page. Marriages were not on the same page uh Marriages were not on the same page uh Marriages were not on the same page uh as far as time and probably right. as far as time and probably right. as far as time and probably right. It's pretty easy to not It's pretty easy to not It's pretty easy to not » understand how much time it's going to » understand how much time it's going to » understand how much time it's going to be till you're in it, right? Like until be till you're in it, right? Like until be till you're in it, right? Like until you're finally in it, you're doing it, you're finally in it, you're doing it, you're finally in it, you're doing it, » you just have no idea. And no matter » you just have no idea. And no matter » you just have no idea. And no matter what anyone tells you, you're like, "No, what anyone tells you, you're like, "No, what anyone tells you, you're like, "No, it's going to be," you know, it's just it's going to be," you know, it's just it's going to be," you know, it's just hard to understand that. Yeah. No, hard to understand that. Yeah. No, hard to understand that. Yeah. No, you're going to have you're going to you're going to have you're going to you're going to have you're going to have 90 hour weeks sometimes when things have 90 hour weeks sometimes when things have 90 hour weeks sometimes when things go bad and you're always on call, go bad and you're always on call, go bad and you're always on call, especially at the beginning. Yes. especially at the beginning. Yes. especially at the beginning. Yes. » Building it out and I can say the » Building it out and I can say the » Building it out and I can say the same thing. I've been very spoiled that same thing. I've been very spoiled that same thing. I've been very spoiled that my wife, who is smarter and more my wife, who is smarter and more my wife, who is smarter and more professional than me, stayed home for 10 professional than me, stayed home for 10 professional than me, stayed home for 10 years before going to work uh for me to years before going to work uh for me to years before going to work uh for me to do what I've done um and enjoy doing. do what I've done um and enjoy doing. do what I've done um and enjoy doing. Um, on the side of finding balance or Um, on the side of finding balance or Um, on the side of finding balance or not, I also like how you say it's I not, I also like how you say it's I not, I also like how you say it's I haven't and then sometimes I have, you haven't and then sometimes I have, you haven't and then sometimes I have, you know, and I do think that know, and I do think that know, and I do think that tug, that pull, it's so much more about tug, that pull, it's so much more about tug, that pull, it's so much more about communication and clarification that communication and clarification that communication and clarification that this will be se moment, this will be a this will be se moment, this will be a this will be se moment, this will be a moment in time where I have to press in. moment in time where I have to press in. moment in time where I have to press in. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » And I feel like a lot of times it's just » And I feel like a lot of times it's just » And I feel like a lot of times it's just there is no communication. some of my there is no communication. some of my there is no communication. some of my friends that own businesses, you know, friends that own businesses, you know, friends that own businesses, you know, to the spouse like, hey, this is this is to the spouse like, hey, this is this is to the spouse like, hey, this is this is my plan. I got to do a lot right now, my plan. I got to do a lot right now, my plan. I got to do a lot right now, but this is how I'm not going to do a do but this is how I'm not going to do a do but this is how I'm not going to do a do a lot, right, a lot, right, a lot, right, » in this time frame, right? And that's » in this time frame, right? And that's » in this time frame, right? And that's that's hard to do. Uh, but if you can that's hard to do. Uh, but if you can that's hard to do. Uh, but if you can communicate that upfront uh as an communicate that upfront uh as an communicate that upfront uh as an entrepreneur, business owner to your entrepreneur, business owner to your entrepreneur, business owner to your spouse, I think that helps a lot. spouse, I think that helps a lot. spouse, I think that helps a lot. » Yeah, I I would absolutely agree. Um » Yeah, I I would absolutely agree. Um » Yeah, I I would absolutely agree. Um it's really important to cut both of it's really important to cut both of it's really important to cut both of yourselves some slack in terms of people yourselves some slack in terms of people yourselves some slack in terms of people want to go in with a very specific plan want to go in with a very specific plan want to go in with a very specific plan and you know a plan is just how I think and you know a plan is just how I think and you know a plan is just how I think it's just a starting point and then it's just a starting point and then it's just a starting point and then whether it be in manufacturing sports whether it be in manufacturing sports whether it be in manufacturing sports war whatever you know that plan gets war whatever you know that plan gets war whatever you know that plan gets blown up in the first few moments of blown up in the first few moments of blown up in the first few moments of execution and then you're like okay this execution and then you're like okay this execution and then you're like okay this is the general direction we're headed so is the general direction we're headed so is the general direction we're headed so now we got to adjust and work and kind now we got to adjust and work and kind now we got to adjust and work and kind of go through that. So that constant, as of go through that. So that constant, as of go through that. So that constant, as you put it, you put it, you put it, » push and pull, that tug, um I think is » push and pull, that tug, um I think is » push and pull, that tug, um I think is healthy. And just to realize, you know healthy. And just to realize, you know healthy. And just to realize, you know what, I'm not always going to be what, I'm not always going to be what, I'm not always going to be perfect. I'm going to make mistakes. I'm perfect. I'm going to make mistakes. I'm perfect. I'm going to make mistakes. I'm going to do things wrong. What's going to do things wrong. What's going to do things wrong. What's important is am I learning from them. important is am I learning from them. important is am I learning from them. » Um unfortunately, I'm a slow learner. Um » Um unfortunately, I'm a slow learner. Um » Um unfortunately, I'm a slow learner. Um and so sometimes it takes like a lot of and so sometimes it takes like a lot of and so sometimes it takes like a lot of beating on me by my team and others beating on me by my team and others beating on me by my team and others to, you know, to be able to get me um in to, you know, to be able to get me um in to, you know, to be able to get me um in the right direction. So, and blessed the right direction. So, and blessed the right direction. So, and blessed with a lot of just great people in my with a lot of just great people in my with a lot of just great people in my life. life. life. » Yeah. No, that's that's really good. Uh, » Yeah. No, that's that's really good. Uh, » Yeah. No, that's that's really good. Uh, what was the hardest part about your what was the hardest part about your what was the hardest part about your business? Uh, business? Uh, business? Uh, worst season, what was the cause? What worst season, what was the cause? What worst season, what was the cause? What was the most difficult part? You came was the most difficult part? You came was the most difficult part? You came out of it and your takeaway was out of it and your takeaway was out of it and your takeaway was » Yeah. Yeah. Um, I got to I got to think » Yeah. Yeah. Um, I got to I got to think » Yeah. Yeah. Um, I got to I got to think about that. about that. about that. » I know. Yeah. It doesn't have to be. » I know. Yeah. It doesn't have to be. » I know. Yeah. It doesn't have to be. » What's the most horrible thing that » What's the most horrible thing that » What's the most horrible thing that you've ever you've ever you've ever » It doesn't have to be the most horrible. » It doesn't have to be the most horrible. » It doesn't have to be the most horrible. just first one that pops in your head. I just first one that pops in your head. I just first one that pops in your head. I should rephrase that question cuz it is should rephrase that question cuz it is should rephrase that question cuz it is everyone has a really hard time with everyone has a really hard time with everyone has a really hard time with that question. that question. that question. » So I, you know, I think just in I think » So I, you know, I think just in I think » So I, you know, I think just in I think in general as I've gotten older, you see in general as I've gotten older, you see in general as I've gotten older, you see a lot of the same cycles over and over a lot of the same cycles over and over a lot of the same cycles over and over again. Um, and sometimes they're with again. Um, and sometimes they're with again. Um, and sometimes they're with customers, sometimes they're with customers, sometimes they're with customers, sometimes they're with people. But especially with like the people. But especially with like the people. But especially with like the I want to say the newer people that kind I want to say the newer people that kind I want to say the newer people that kind of come into the business either in the of come into the business either in the of come into the business either in the customer supply base whatever but customer supply base whatever but customer supply base whatever but they've got the same stuff that you've they've got the same stuff that you've they've got the same stuff that you've heard before and it's like oh we've got heard before and it's like oh we've got heard before and it's like oh we've got this XYZ you know and you've got to go this XYZ you know and you've got to go this XYZ you know and you've got to go do this and if you do this then you're do this and if you do this then you're do this and if you do this then you're going to just get all sorts of business going to just get all sorts of business going to just get all sorts of business and blah and you just know and blah and you just know and blah and you just know that's not how it works right or that's not how it works right or that's not how it works right or there's the um the idealistic individual there's the um the idealistic individual there's the um the idealistic individual that comes in and you got to that comes in and you got to that comes in and you got to be careful because there's a lot of good be careful because there's a lot of good be careful because there's a lot of good ideas you can quickly dismiss, but it's ideas you can quickly dismiss, but it's ideas you can quickly dismiss, but it's like sometimes they come in with a lot like sometimes they come in with a lot like sometimes they come in with a lot of enthusiasm. It's like, well, why are of enthusiasm. It's like, well, why are of enthusiasm. It's like, well, why are all these things broken? I was like, you all these things broken? I was like, you all these things broken? I was like, you need to live in business for a little need to live in business for a little need to live in business for a little bit. Understand the world's not perfect, bit. Understand the world's not perfect, bit. Understand the world's not perfect, right? right? right? » And so, I think the older I get, the » And so, I think the older I get, the » And so, I think the older I get, the more I have to really pour patience into more I have to really pour patience into more I have to really pour patience into those situations because it's like, those situations because it's like, those situations because it's like, okay, well, here we go again. especially okay, well, here we go again. especially okay, well, here we go again. especially on the customer side. And I hate to put on the customer side. And I hate to put on the customer side. And I hate to put it that way, but it that way, but it that way, but » sure. Um, so it it's really just about » sure. Um, so it it's really just about » sure. Um, so it it's really just about understanding that the world and understanding that the world and understanding that the world and other people don't necessarily have your other people don't necessarily have your other people don't necessarily have your experience and your knowledge base and experience and your knowledge base and experience and your knowledge base and you know so try to do some education as you know so try to do some education as you know so try to do some education as much as possible but also trust your gut much as possible but also trust your gut much as possible but also trust your gut you know and know stand your ground you know and know stand your ground you know and know stand your ground when people come in and are um when people come in and are um when people come in and are um when you know what's right give them you know what's right give them you know what's right give them some latitude to try to learn. Um but at some latitude to try to learn. Um but at some latitude to try to learn. Um but at the same time you don't have to go with the same time you don't have to go with the same time you don't have to go with every prevailing win that the customer every prevailing win that the customer every prevailing win that the customer or the you know people have. And so the or the you know people have. And so the or the you know people have. And so the thing that I love most about business thing that I love most about business thing that I love most about business which is the people I think is also the which is the people I think is also the which is the people I think is also the thing that I struggle the most with thing that I struggle the most with thing that I struggle the most with businesses is is the people. businesses is is the people. businesses is is the people. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Right. » Right. » Right. » Yeah. Um, and I I I think the thing that » Yeah. Um, and I I I think the thing that » Yeah. Um, and I I I think the thing that the biggest takeaway for me is I have to the biggest takeaway for me is I have to the biggest takeaway for me is I have to look over my life and say all the people look over my life and say all the people look over my life and say all the people that were patient with me, especially that were patient with me, especially that were patient with me, especially God who's been so patient with me over, God who's been so patient with me over, God who's been so patient with me over, you know, the last 51 years, right, you know, the last 51 years, right, you know, the last 51 years, right, since I was born. Um, how can I not do since I was born. Um, how can I not do since I was born. Um, how can I not do that for other individuals? And I really that for other individuals? And I really that for other individuals? And I really sometimes struggle with it and I have to sometimes struggle with it and I have to sometimes struggle with it and I have to just » step back, » step back, » step back, » take um some accounting of my own » take um some accounting of my own » take um some accounting of my own actions and then try to re-engage in in actions and then try to re-engage in in actions and then try to re-engage in in a nicer way. Right. So a nicer way. Right. So a nicer way. Right. So » that's really good. » that's really good. » that's really good. » Yep. That's powerful. » Yep. That's powerful. » Yep. That's powerful. » You got anything on your side, Norris? » You got anything on your side, Norris? » You got anything on your side, Norris? Cuz I I saw you over there rocking hard Cuz I I saw you over there rocking hard Cuz I I saw you over there rocking hard when we were talking about robotics. when we were talking about robotics. when we were talking about robotics. » So yeah, I know, right? I tried my best » So yeah, I know, right? I tried my best » So yeah, I know, right? I tried my best to ask questions you would want to hear. to ask questions you would want to hear. to ask questions you would want to hear. My favorite part about this podcast is My favorite part about this podcast is My favorite part about this podcast is Tyler breaking the fourth wall and you Tyler breaking the fourth wall and you Tyler breaking the fourth wall and you just kind of barely hear him on the just kind of barely hear him on the just kind of barely hear him on the podcast. He'll yell something. podcast. He'll yell something. podcast. He'll yell something. » That's awesome. » That's awesome. » That's awesome. » We're never gonna give him a mic. He's » We're never gonna give him a mic. He's » We're never gonna give him a mic. He's got to stay off. But got to stay off. But got to stay off. But » no, that's great. Uh I man, I so » no, that's great. Uh I man, I so » no, that's great. Uh I man, I so appreciate your time. Um I feel like I appreciate your time. Um I feel like I appreciate your time. Um I feel like I could go on forever about just that could go on forever about just that could go on forever about just that dynamic of B2B. That might be a whole dynamic of B2B. That might be a whole dynamic of B2B. That might be a whole another podcast that would be fun to do another podcast that would be fun to do another podcast that would be fun to do down the road with you is just talking down the road with you is just talking down the road with you is just talking about the last 5 years of building a B2B about the last 5 years of building a B2B about the last 5 years of building a B2B consulting development for various consulting development for various consulting development for various industries. Uh we should just go have industries. Uh we should just go have industries. Uh we should just go have lunch and talk about it regardless. lunch and talk about it regardless. lunch and talk about it regardless. Sounds great. But a lot of gold nuggets. Sounds great. But a lot of gold nuggets. Sounds great. But a lot of gold nuggets. Thank you so much and uh really Thank you so much and uh really Thank you so much and uh really appreciate your time. appreciate your time. appreciate your time. » Yeah, thank you for the invite. Yeah, » Yeah, thank you for the invite. Yeah, » Yeah, thank you for the invite. Yeah, » thank you. ---