It's Not If, It's When: Cybersecurity, AI, and IT as a Business Tool with J.D. Zluticky | Ep 70

So the question is what is that for AI? So the question is what is that for AI? Give me your best Give me your best Give me your best » and that's it. Well, » and that's it. Well, » and that's it. Well, » give me a hypothetical. » give me a hypothetical. » give me a hypothetical. » Well, I think that what's going to » Well, I think that what's going to » Well, I think that what's going to happen is is that um I I'm not convinced happen is is that um I I'm not convinced happen is is that um I I'm not convinced AI is going to take your job. Um I think AI is going to take your job. Um I think AI is going to take your job. Um I think it's a little more complicated than it's a little more complicated than it's a little more complicated than that, right? I just think human beings that, right? I just think human beings that, right? I just think human beings and human minds and the way humans and human minds and the way humans and human minds and the way humans think. I I don't know that all the think. I I don't know that all the think. I I don't know that all the scientific or all the science fiction scientific or all the science fiction scientific or all the science fiction stuff about, you know, thinking stuff about, you know, thinking stuff about, you know, thinking computers is really going to happen or computers is really going to happen or computers is really going to happen or not. But I guess we'll wait and see. not. But I guess we'll wait and see. not. But I guess we'll wait and see. That's true. That's true. That's true. » But at the end of the day, I don't think » But at the end of the day, I don't think » But at the end of the day, I don't think AI in the next 10 years is going to take AI in the next 10 years is going to take AI in the next 10 years is going to take your job. But I think someone who knows your job. But I think someone who knows your job. But I think someone who knows how to use AI to do your job is likely how to use AI to do your job is likely how to use AI to do your job is likely to take your job. to take your job. to take your job. » The Killer Growth podcast starts now. » The Killer Growth podcast starts now. » The Killer Growth podcast starts now. » What's up guys? Sam Mcbay here with the » What's up guys? Sam Mcbay here with the Killer Growth podcast and today I have Killer Growth podcast and today I have Killer Growth podcast and today I have JD Zudiki. JD Zudiki. JD Zudiki. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome. » Hey, thanks. Glad to be here. » Hey, thanks. Glad to be here. » Hey, thanks. Glad to be here. » You you drove uh the long way from » You you drove uh the long way from » You you drove uh the long way from Witchaw to El Dredo. Witchaw to El Dredo. Witchaw to El Dredo. » Yeah. All 38 minutes of it. » Yeah. All 38 minutes of it. » Yeah. All 38 minutes of it. » 30 Yeah. Anything exciting happened on » 30 Yeah. Anything exciting happened on » 30 Yeah. Anything exciting happened on » uh just the rain, right? About 10 miles » uh just the rain, right? About 10 miles » uh just the rain, right? About 10 miles west of here. It was coming down pretty. west of here. It was coming down pretty. west of here. It was coming down pretty. » This is the first. So, you're our second » This is the first. So, you're our second » This is the first. So, you're our second podcast in the new studio and we're next podcast in the new studio and we're next podcast in the new studio and we're next to some glass. So, it's kind of nice. I to some glass. So, it's kind of nice. I to some glass. So, it's kind of nice. I can hear the rain. I thought about can hear the rain. I thought about can hear the rain. I thought about opening the door so we could have some opening the door so we could have some opening the door so we could have some ambiance » coming into the mic, Tyler, but uh » coming into the mic, Tyler, but uh » coming into the mic, Tyler, but uh that's all right. Uh JD, uh founder of that's all right. Uh JD, uh founder of that's all right. Uh JD, uh founder of Central IT Services. Uh so, you're my Central IT Services. Uh so, you're my Central IT Services. Uh so, you're my first IT like all-in IT podcast guest. first IT like all-in IT podcast guest. first IT like all-in IT podcast guest. Uh so, thanks for I've been waiting for Uh so, thanks for I've been waiting for Uh so, thanks for I've been waiting for you. you. you. » Okay. to be our uh voice of » Okay. to be our uh voice of » Okay. to be our uh voice of authority on it and all things it uh authority on it and all things it uh authority on it and all things it uh which is not an exciting topic and I'm which is not an exciting topic and I'm which is not an exciting topic and I'm hoping you can make it exciting. hoping you can make it exciting. hoping you can make it exciting. » Oh well that may be a tall order. Um » Oh well that may be a tall order. Um » Oh well that may be a tall order. Um most people it just glazes you know they most people it just glazes you know they most people it just glazes you know they just glaze over and don't understand just glaze over and don't understand just glaze over and don't understand » don't want to think about it so they » don't want to think about it so they » don't want to think about it so they hire you. Yeah makes sense. Well let's hire you. Yeah makes sense. Well let's hire you. Yeah makes sense. Well let's start with uh uh college what you went start with uh uh college what you went start with uh uh college what you went to college for and then how you got into to college for and then how you got into to college for and then how you got into it. I think would be cool to hear. it. I think would be cool to hear. it. I think would be cool to hear. » Okay. Well, um, those are not really » Okay. Well, um, those are not really » Okay. Well, um, those are not really related, right? Because I I was a late related, right? Because I I was a late related, right? Because I I was a late bloomer going to college, right? So, bloomer going to college, right? So, bloomer going to college, right? So, after high school, I joined the Navy after high school, I joined the Navy after high school, I joined the Navy and, uh, did that for 12 or 13 years and, uh, did that for 12 or 13 years and, uh, did that for 12 or 13 years and then came back home and decided to, uh, then came back home and decided to, uh, then came back home and decided to, uh, go back to school and, you know, create go back to school and, you know, create go back to school and, you know, create a career from that. Um, so I actually my a career from that. Um, so I actually my a career from that. Um, so I actually my undergraduate degree is in international undergraduate degree is in international undergraduate degree is in international business because we were stationed business because we were stationed business because we were stationed overseas a lot and we had done some overseas a lot and we had done some overseas a lot and we had done some playing around, you know, just on a uh playing around, you know, just on a uh playing around, you know, just on a uh residential level, right? Buying and residential level, right? Buying and residential level, right? Buying and selling some things overseas and we selling some things overseas and we selling some things overseas and we thought, hey, that would be a really thought, hey, that would be a really thought, hey, that would be a really cool thing to be one of these big import cool thing to be one of these big import cool thing to be one of these big import export people. export people. export people. » Yeah. Uh so I came back here to do that » Yeah. Uh so I came back here to do that » Yeah. Uh so I came back here to do that but I needed to make some money while I but I needed to make some money while I but I needed to make some money while I was going to school and uh yeah I got an was going to school and uh yeah I got an was going to school and uh yeah I got an IT job which I was well qualified for IT job which I was well qualified for IT job which I was well qualified for and then I started this business and we and then I started this business and we and then I started this business and we just never looked back. So the just never looked back. So the just never looked back. So the » So explain that to me. What do you mean » So explain that to me. What do you mean » So explain that to me. What do you mean wellqualified for it? wellqualified for it? wellqualified for it? » Um well first of all uh I had been » Um well first of all uh I had been » Um well first of all uh I had been playing with computers since high playing with computers since high playing with computers since high school. My dad had brought home what was school. My dad had brought home what was school. My dad had brought home what was called a Heath kit called a Heath kit called a Heath kit » and so you really built your own » and so you really built your own » and so you really built your own computer out of it computer out of it computer out of it » and uh we did that in high school. My » and uh we did that in high school. My » and uh we did that in high school. My dad thought it would be interesting to dad thought it would be interesting to dad thought it would be interesting to uh play with those. And so we did some uh play with those. And so we did some uh play with those. And so we did some of that and then we've got a an Apple 2e of that and then we've got a an Apple 2e of that and then we've got a an Apple 2e » and did some software programming and » and did some software programming and » and did some software programming and that kind of thing. And then I that kind of thing. And then I that kind of thing. And then I graduated, ran off and joined the Navy. graduated, ran off and joined the Navy. graduated, ran off and joined the Navy. But while I was in the Navy, I ended up But while I was in the Navy, I ended up But while I was in the Navy, I ended up migrating towards some IT type jobs. Of migrating towards some IT type jobs. Of migrating towards some IT type jobs. Of course, it was not a thing course, it was not a thing course, it was not a thing at that point, but uh but there were at that point, but uh but there were at that point, but uh but there were some computers and they were starting to some computers and they were starting to some computers and they were starting to take off and so um I was pretty take off and so um I was pretty take off and so um I was pretty much got qualified doing that. much got qualified doing that. much got qualified doing that. » Yeah, I bet. Uh yeah, it back then I'm » Yeah, I bet. Uh yeah, it back then I'm » Yeah, I bet. Uh yeah, it back then I'm sure a lot of it was just they didn't sure a lot of it was just they didn't sure a lot of it was just they didn't even know how to turn it on. Like I mean even know how to turn it on. Like I mean even know how to turn it on. Like I mean I'm sure it's evolved from like how do I I'm sure it's evolved from like how do I I'm sure it's evolved from like how do I even do anything with this to okay now even do anything with this to okay now even do anything with this to okay now it doesn't work fix it. it doesn't work fix it. it doesn't work fix it. » Right. Right. and then probably both. » Right. Right. and then probably both. » Right. Right. and then probably both. » Well, and the interesting part was it » Well, and the interesting part was it » Well, and the interesting part was it was actually uh in those days, I mean, was actually uh in those days, I mean, was actually uh in those days, I mean, we're talking about 1990, 1991, right? we're talking about 1990, 1991, right? we're talking about 1990, 1991, right? Um the radio men on the ship were the Um the radio men on the ship were the Um the radio men on the ship were the closest thing, right, to uh computer closest thing, right, to uh computer closest thing, right, to uh computer texts, right? And so that's and funny, texts, right? And so that's and funny, texts, right? And so that's and funny, that's kind of how I got started at this that's kind of how I got started at this that's kind of how I got started at this anyway, was u you know, here I was I was anyway, was u you know, here I was I was anyway, was u you know, here I was I was I was at uh the submarine base in Pearl I was at uh the submarine base in Pearl I was at uh the submarine base in Pearl Harbor and I'm in charge of this Harbor and I'm in charge of this Harbor and I'm in charge of this technical library. supervising it and we technical library. supervising it and we technical library. supervising it and we had a couple of computers in there and I had a couple of computers in there and I had a couple of computers in there and I had to go ask the radio men for some had to go ask the radio men for some had to go ask the radio men for some assistance and you go over there and uh they're and you go over there and uh they're and you go over there and uh they're just like typical IT people, right? So just like typical IT people, right? So just like typical IT people, right? So they have secret and top secret they have secret and top secret they have secret and top secret information. So they have a vault so you information. So they have a vault so you information. So they have a vault so you really stand outside and knock on the really stand outside and knock on the really stand outside and knock on the door » and they open the little, you know, » and they open the little, you know, » and they open the little, you know, peepphole and like who are you? What do peepphole and like who are you? What do peepphole and like who are you? What do you want? Go away. We're too busy for you want? Go away. We're too busy for you want? Go away. We're too busy for you. Um, and it it kind of hurt my you. Um, and it it kind of hurt my you. Um, and it it kind of hurt my feelings a little bit and I was like, feelings a little bit and I was like, feelings a little bit and I was like, well, you know, I could work circles well, you know, I could work circles well, you know, I could work circles around you guys. And so I set off to around you guys. And so I set off to around you guys. And so I set off to prove that I could. prove that I could. prove that I could. » Yeah, that's awesome. [clears throat] » Yeah, that's awesome. [clears throat] » Yeah, that's awesome. [clears throat] Uh, that Thunder, I don't know if it Uh, that Thunder, I don't know if it Uh, that Thunder, I don't know if it came on the mic, but that might be the came on the mic, but that might be the came on the mic, but that might be the first time Thunder was on the Killer first time Thunder was on the Killer first time Thunder was on the Killer Girl podcast. Girl podcast. Girl podcast. » Squirrel Brain, » Squirrel Brain, » Squirrel Brain, » first time for everything, » first time for everything, » first time for everything, right? right? right? » We've got a lot of first today. » We've got a lot of first today. » We've got a lot of first today. » U, so yeah, talk about the time and the » U, so yeah, talk about the time and the » U, so yeah, talk about the time and the I'm curious. This is irrelevant to it, I'm curious. This is irrelevant to it, I'm curious. This is irrelevant to it, but you just provided context why it's but you just provided context why it's but you just provided context why it's not. But in the Navy, what did not. But in the Navy, what did not. But in the Navy, what did technology look like when in what years technology look like when in what years technology look like when in what years were you in the Navy? Like were you in the Navy? Like were you in the Navy? Like » um I was in the Navy from 85 to 97. So I » um I was in the Navy from 85 to 97. So I » um I was in the Navy from 85 to 97. So I went in in January, got out in December, went in in January, got out in December, went in in January, got out in December, so just shy of 13 years. so just shy of 13 years. so just shy of 13 years. » Yeah. Wow. » Yeah. Wow. » Yeah. Wow. » And um uh so the computers we were » And um uh so the computers we were » And um uh so the computers we were working on were the old, you know, green working on were the old, you know, green working on were the old, you know, green screen monochrome monitors, you know, 9 screen monochrome monitors, you know, 9 screen monochrome monitors, you know, 9 or 10 in across or something. And but we or 10 in across or something. And but we or 10 in across or something. And but we had keyboards, had keyboards, had keyboards, » right? you know, so at least we had » right? you know, so at least we had » right? you know, so at least we had that. Um, that. Um, that. Um, we had some pretty cool technology. we had some pretty cool technology. we had some pretty cool technology. » Was it a mouse or all keyboard, » Was it a mouse or all keyboard, » Was it a mouse or all keyboard, » you know, I I think we did not have a » you know, I I think we did not have a » you know, I I think we did not have a mouse at that time because it was all mouse at that time because it was all mouse at that time because it was all just text on a Chrome screens, right? just text on a Chrome screens, right? just text on a Chrome screens, right? There were no no real graphics or There were no no real graphics or There were no no real graphics or anything. So, everything was just cursor anything. So, everything was just cursor anything. So, everything was just cursor entries. entries. entries. » Gosh, that's crazy. » Gosh, that's crazy. » Gosh, that's crazy. » Uh, did it change in the 13 years? Did » Uh, did it change in the 13 years? Did » Uh, did it change in the 13 years? Did you see much change? Um yes, as a matter you see much change? Um yes, as a matter you see much change? Um yes, as a matter of fact, uh when I was at that submarine of fact, uh when I was at that submarine of fact, uh when I was at that submarine base in Pearl Harbor, it was uh my first base in Pearl Harbor, it was uh my first base in Pearl Harbor, it was uh my first exposure, probably 92, maybe early 93, exposure, probably 92, maybe early 93, exposure, probably 92, maybe early 93, right? My first exposure to HTML code right? My first exposure to HTML code right? My first exposure to HTML code and you know the concept of having an and you know the concept of having an and you know the concept of having an HTML link where you can actually see the HTML link where you can actually see the HTML link where you can actually see the words that say see figure one and then words that say see figure one and then words that say see figure one and then you click on it and it jumps through the you click on it and it jumps through the you click on it and it jumps through the document and shows you figure one. I document and shows you figure one. I document and shows you figure one. I [snorts] mean, we all just take that for [snorts] mean, we all just take that for [snorts] mean, we all just take that for granted today, but I like that was my granted today, but I like that was my granted today, but I like that was my first experience with that was in that first experience with that was in that first experience with that was in that uh technical library at the submarine uh technical library at the submarine uh technical library at the submarine base. So, base. So, base. So, » what was your main job the whole » what was your main job the whole » what was your main job the whole time? I know people kind of get time? I know people kind of get time? I know people kind of get assigned. Did you jump around or after assigned. Did you jump around or after assigned. Did you jump around or after your first three or four years, your job your first three or four years, your job your first three or four years, your job was » um so the Navy sent me to school to be a » um so the Navy sent me to school to be a » um so the Navy sent me to school to be a machinist mate? I worked in the engine machinist mate? I worked in the engine machinist mate? I worked in the engine rooms, turned valves, turned wrenches rooms, turned valves, turned wrenches rooms, turned valves, turned wrenches and um and um and um » just a couple of opportunities came » just a couple of opportunities came » just a couple of opportunities came along » to use the computer and um yeah, I took » to use the computer and um yeah, I took » to use the computer and um yeah, I took advantage of those opportunities. I advantage of those opportunities. I advantage of those opportunities. I liked them and liked them and liked them and » I wasn't afraid of it. Everyone else was » I wasn't afraid of it. Everyone else was » I wasn't afraid of it. Everyone else was kind of timid and I was like, "No, I can kind of timid and I was like, "No, I can kind of timid and I was like, "No, I can do that." So do that." So do that." So » that's cool. That's awesome. So that » that's cool. That's awesome. So that » that's cool. That's awesome. So that brings you back get the international brings you back get the international brings you back get the international business degree. uh talk about that business degree. uh talk about that business degree. uh talk about that because I'm not so it makes total sense because I'm not so it makes total sense because I'm not so it makes total sense but when I saw that in your bio I was but when I saw that in your bio I was but when I saw that in your bio I was like oh that's uh just not a common like oh that's uh just not a common like oh that's uh just not a common thing I hear about anymore that I hear thing I hear about anymore that I hear thing I hear about anymore that I hear they get their business degree or their they get their business degree or their they get their business degree or their MBA but MBA but MBA but » international business at that point was » international business at that point was » international business at that point was probably a big deal and still I mean probably a big deal and still I mean probably a big deal and still I mean still is uh export import still is uh export import still is uh export import » sure » sure » sure » um but what was the endgame there at the » um but what was the endgame there at the » um but what was the endgame there at the time obviously went a different route time obviously went a different route time obviously went a different route » I'm sorry why we went a different route » I'm sorry why we went a different route » I'm sorry why we went a different route or or or » no no like what was the goal with the » no no like what was the goal with the » no no like what was the goal with the international business degree at the international business degree at the international business degree at the time of getting that degree? What were time of getting that degree? What were time of getting that degree? What were you thinking it would look like after? you thinking it would look like after? you thinking it would look like after? » Well, you know, it's u kind of the » Well, you know, it's u kind of the » Well, you know, it's u kind of the cliche, right? Join the Navy, see the cliche, right? Join the Navy, see the cliche, right? Join the Navy, see the world. Uh I was able to do that. Uh went world. Uh I was able to do that. Uh went world. Uh I was able to do that. Uh went to, you know, probably five continents to, you know, probably five continents to, you know, probably five continents while I was in the Navy. So, I saw a lot while I was in the Navy. So, I saw a lot while I was in the Navy. So, I saw a lot of stuff. Uh many different countries. of stuff. Uh many different countries. of stuff. Uh many different countries. Um had the opportunity to uh be really Um had the opportunity to uh be really Um had the opportunity to uh be really poor at some different languages and poor at some different languages and poor at some different languages and that kind of thing. And um as again as I that kind of thing. And um as again as I that kind of thing. And um as again as I mentioned earlier we had done some mentioned earlier we had done some mentioned earlier we had done some dabbling. We went on vacation and bought dabbling. We went on vacation and bought dabbling. We went on vacation and bought some doilies and stuff that you know my some doilies and stuff that you know my some doilies and stuff that you know my wife wanted and we bought a few extra wife wanted and we bought a few extra wife wanted and we bought a few extra for friends and then people started for friends and then people started for friends and then people started saying hey why didn't you buy more so saying hey why didn't you buy more so saying hey why didn't you buy more so that we could buy those from you. So, we that we could buy those from you. So, we that we could buy those from you. So, we scheduled another trip and went back and scheduled another trip and went back and scheduled another trip and went back and bought some more and then, you know, bought some more and then, you know, bought some more and then, you know, brought them back and sold them and we brought them back and sold them and we brought them back and sold them and we just thought that'd be a really cool just thought that'd be a really cool just thought that'd be a really cool thing to do and wanted to be educated thing to do and wanted to be educated thing to do and wanted to be educated about the process back to school to get about the process back to school to get about the process back to school to get my degree. my degree. my degree. » Yeah. So, then we're uh moonlighting it » Yeah. So, then we're uh moonlighting it » Yeah. So, then we're uh moonlighting it for some companies during college. for some companies during college. for some companies during college. » Is that how the IT thing started? No, » Is that how the IT thing started? No, » Is that how the IT thing started? No, actually what happened with that was um actually what happened with that was um actually what happened with that was um I had done some dabbling on base, some I had done some dabbling on base, some I had done some dabbling on base, some basic residential computer repair help. basic residential computer repair help. basic residential computer repair help. You I'm charging by the hour. You I'm charging by the hour. You I'm charging by the hour. » Gotcha. » Gotcha. » Gotcha. » Um and when I came back here, um my » Um and when I came back here, um my » Um and when I came back here, um my original thought was, you know, I'll do original thought was, you know, I'll do original thought was, you know, I'll do this part-time while I go to school and this part-time while I go to school and this part-time while I go to school and uh that uh yeah, it takes a little bit uh that uh yeah, it takes a little bit uh that uh yeah, it takes a little bit of time and energy to get a new business of time and energy to get a new business of time and energy to get a new business started and especially one that will pay started and especially one that will pay started and especially one that will pay all the bills and everything. and my all the bills and everything. and my all the bills and everything. and my uncle called me and said that uh the uncle called me and said that uh the uncle called me and said that uh the place where he worked was hiring an IT place where he worked was hiring an IT place where he worked was hiring an IT manager and they you know he thought manager and they you know he thought manager and they you know he thought maybe I'd be interested in applying. So maybe I'd be interested in applying. So maybe I'd be interested in applying. So I went and got that job and did that for I went and got that job and did that for I went and got that job and did that for a couple years while I tried to figure a couple years while I tried to figure a couple years while I tried to figure out how to start my own business and it out how to start my own business and it out how to start my own business and it was really just working parallel paths. was really just working parallel paths. was really just working parallel paths. » Yeah, that makes sense. » Yeah, that makes sense. » Yeah, that makes sense. » And uh this one took off and we've never » And uh this one took off and we've never » And uh this one took off and we've never looked back. looked back. looked back. » Yeah. Yeah. So 99 I see is when you » Yeah. Yeah. So 99 I see is when you » Yeah. Yeah. So 99 I see is when you founded Essential IT, founded Essential IT, founded Essential IT, » right? That's when we incorporated it. » right? That's when we incorporated it. » right? That's when we incorporated it. incorporated it. Okay. Um and so what incorporated it. Okay. Um and so what incorporated it. Okay. Um and so what did it some version of it exist what did it some version of it exist what did it some version of it exist before that before 99? before that before 99? before that before 99? » Um it did. So when uh when I was in the » Um it did. So when uh when I was in the » Um it did. So when uh when I was in the military, right, part military, right, part military, right, part um coined the name the PC doctor, which um coined the name the PC doctor, which um coined the name the PC doctor, which was kind of an interesting thing. was kind of an interesting thing. was kind of an interesting thing. » Oh yeah. » Oh yeah. » Oh yeah. » My um I used to carry this little black » My um I used to carry this little black » My um I used to carry this little black satchel with, you know, some satchel with, you know, some satchel with, you know, some screwdrivers and wrenches and things screwdrivers and wrenches and things screwdrivers and wrenches and things into it. And uh I went over to a into it. And uh I went over to a into it. And uh I went over to a friend's house and he's like, you know, friend's house and he's like, you know, friend's house and he's like, you know, you're you're like a doctor for PCs. You you're you're like a doctor for PCs. You you're you're like a doctor for PCs. You carry your little black bag everywhere carry your little black bag everywhere carry your little black bag everywhere you go. you go. you go. » Sounds like the making of an IT » Sounds like the making of an IT » Sounds like the making of an IT franchise. franchise. franchise. Dr. PC, you got one in your location. Dr. PC, you got one in your location. Dr. PC, you got one in your location. » Yeah. So, that's what we started with » Yeah. So, that's what we started with » Yeah. So, that's what we started with and um you know, then we kind of changed and um you know, then we kind of changed and um you know, then we kind of changed some » went to the other. Uh so, let's » went to the other. Uh so, let's » went to the other. Uh so, let's [clears throat] go like beginning all [clears throat] go like beginning all [clears throat] go like beginning all the way to end just broad. I I'm really the way to end just broad. I I'm really the way to end just broad. I I'm really curious and this will probably go into a curious and this will probably go into a curious and this will probably go into a lot of other conversations. So, 20 what lot of other conversations. So, 20 what lot of other conversations. So, 20 what 25 plus years now? Like what did 25 plus years now? Like what did 25 plus years now? Like what did essential it look like? you know, the essential it look like? you know, the essential it look like? you know, the first five years to like what it looks first five years to like what it looks first five years to like what it looks like now, like how much has it changed? like now, like how much has it changed? like now, like how much has it changed? Take us through that. Like type of Take us through that. Like type of Take us through that. Like type of industry you served to like the type of industry you served to like the type of industry you served to like the type of services to like what your actual job services to like what your actual job services to like what your actual job » incorporated. » incorporated. » incorporated. » Okay. Well, um, in some respects that » Okay. Well, um, in some respects that » Okay. Well, um, in some respects that hasn't changed a lot. How we do it hasn't changed a lot. How we do it hasn't changed a lot. How we do it changed. changed. changed. » Okay. » Okay. » Okay. » Uh, when we do it has changed » Uh, when we do it has changed » Uh, when we do it has changed significantly, but, uh, the overlying significantly, but, uh, the overlying significantly, but, uh, the overlying job is still pretty much the same. Um I job is still pretty much the same. Um I job is still pretty much the same. Um I think at the beginning I was just think at the beginning I was just think at the beginning I was just concerned about making things work. That concerned about making things work. That concerned about making things work. That was my onus. There were a lot of uh was my onus. There were a lot of uh was my onus. There were a lot of uh customers that we had in the early days customers that we had in the early days customers that we had in the early days that seemed to just have a problem that seemed to just have a problem that seemed to just have a problem making things work and you know that's making things work and you know that's making things work and you know that's still the problem today. still the problem today. still the problem today. » Sure. » Sure. » Sure. » Um in those days it took hours to do » Um in those days it took hours to do » Um in those days it took hours to do things. So, um, we actually got a lot of things. So, um, we actually got a lot of things. So, um, we actually got a lot of customers in the beginning because they customers in the beginning because they customers in the beginning because they had the old, uh, frame relays and DSL had the old, uh, frame relays and DSL had the old, uh, frame relays and DSL internet connections, which were so internet connections, which were so internet connections, which were so incredibly slow compared to today's incredibly slow compared to today's incredibly slow compared to today's things. And no one knew how to program things. And no one knew how to program things. And no one knew how to program those. No one could figure out how to those. No one could figure out how to those. No one could figure out how to get those going. So, we picked up a lot get those going. So, we picked up a lot get those going. So, we picked up a lot of customers because we had some friends of customers because we had some friends of customers because we had some friends that were in the uh telecommunications that were in the uh telecommunications that were in the uh telecommunications industry that would sell those internet industry that would sell those internet industry that would sell those internet connections and then we would go in and connections and then we would go in and connections and then we would go in and install the routers and then we would install the routers and then we would install the routers and then we would kind of pick up work from that. Um, kind of pick up work from that. Um, kind of pick up work from that. Um, today of course, you know, you just go today of course, you know, you just go today of course, you know, you just go to Google. I mean, not Google, but you to Google. I mean, not Google, but you to Google. I mean, not Google, but you just go to Best Buy or Amazon, right? just go to Best Buy or Amazon, right? just go to Best Buy or Amazon, right? And you pick up a router firewall and And you pick up a router firewall and And you pick up a router firewall and you just plug it in and it works. Mhm. you just plug it in and it works. Mhm. you just plug it in and it works. Mhm. » But in those days it was considerably » But in those days it was considerably » But in those days it was considerably more complicated to do that. more complicated to do that. more complicated to do that. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Um so we in the beginning we just wanted » Um so we in the beginning we just wanted » Um so we in the beginning we just wanted to make things work and we were pretty to make things work and we were pretty to make things work and we were pretty good at just coming in with what you had good at just coming in with what you had good at just coming in with what you had meeting you where you were and just meeting you where you were and just meeting you where you were and just stitching the pieces together and make stitching the pieces together and make stitching the pieces together and make everything work. And we still do quite a everything work. And we still do quite a everything work. And we still do quite a bit of that today too. uh there's still bit of that today too. uh there's still bit of that today too. uh there's still maybe it's even worse today because maybe it's even worse today because maybe it's even worse today because there are so many more disparate systems there are so many more disparate systems there are so many more disparate systems that need to be tied together uh that we that need to be tied together uh that we that need to be tied together uh that we still do quite a bit of that. still do quite a bit of that. still do quite a bit of that. » Yeah. Yeah. Uh so how much uh has » Yeah. Yeah. Uh so how much uh has » Yeah. Yeah. Uh so how much uh has software I mean I think of SAS software I mean I think of SAS software I mean I think of SAS software as a service that obviously as a service that obviously as a service that obviously probably existed then and some I mean probably existed then and some I mean probably existed then and some I mean everybody had some type of CRM or everybody had some type of CRM or everybody had some type of CRM or database um to now I mean now you're database um to now I mean now you're database um to now I mean now you're probably helping clients that have probably helping clients that have probably helping clients that have Salesforce or they have a CRM off the Salesforce or they have a CRM off the Salesforce or they have a CRM off the shelf. Um do you participate in that? I shelf. Um do you participate in that? I shelf. Um do you participate in that? I I've wondered if a lot of IT companies I've wondered if a lot of IT companies I've wondered if a lot of IT companies now just help people also just manage now just help people also just manage now just help people also just manage their existing CRM. their existing CRM. their existing CRM. » We do. Um and we still have a mix of » We do. Um and we still have a mix of » We do. Um and we still have a mix of onremise type applications and a lot of onremise type applications and a lot of onremise type applications and a lot of cloud applications. Of course, cloud applications. Of course, cloud applications. Of course, everything seems to be moving more and everything seems to be moving more and everything seems to be moving more and more to the cloud. Um here in the more to the cloud. Um here in the more to the cloud. Um here in the Midwest, we find there's still a little Midwest, we find there's still a little Midwest, we find there's still a little bit of a trust issue. It's it's it's bit of a trust issue. It's it's it's bit of a trust issue. It's it's it's rapidly changing these days, but there rapidly changing these days, but there rapidly changing these days, but there was a long time when people didn't trust was a long time when people didn't trust was a long time when people didn't trust an off- premises server. So they wanted an off- premises server. So they wanted an off- premises server. So they wanted to have their own to have their own to have their own » interesting » interesting » interesting » hardware and control over everything but » hardware and control over everything but » hardware and control over everything but that's with uh with the proliferation of that's with uh with the proliferation of that's with uh with the proliferation of the cloud the cloud the cloud » that's really started to change. So, but » that's really started to change. So, but » that's really started to change. So, but uh most of our clients still do maintain uh most of our clients still do maintain uh most of our clients still do maintain some form of server some form of server some form of server » locally for whatever purpose, right? » locally for whatever purpose, right? » locally for whatever purpose, right? » That obviously would get us into talking » That obviously would get us into talking » That obviously would get us into talking about how data centers have changed about how data centers have changed about how data centers have changed things, but that is too volatile of a things, but that is too volatile of a things, but that is too volatile of a subject right now. So, we're not going subject right now. So, we're not going subject right now. So, we're not going to talk about data centers. to talk about data centers. to talk about data centers. » We're not clipping that, Tyler. » We're not clipping that, Tyler. » We're not clipping that, Tyler. » No, no controversy. I mean, that's where » No, no controversy. I mean, that's where » No, no controversy. I mean, that's where the fun is, right? the fun is, right? the fun is, right? » I know. Well, it is wild. Um when a what » I know. Well, it is wild. Um when a what » I know. Well, it is wild. Um when a what year did AWS start their cloud service? year did AWS start their cloud service? year did AWS start their cloud service? I Tyler might know he's a long I Tyler might know he's a long I Tyler might know he's a long » been a long time. Was it early 2000s or » been a long time. Was it early 2000s or » been a long time. Was it early 2000s or was it later was it later was it later » 0809 » 0809 » 0809 » 08? Okay. So kind of when the Yeah. » 08? Okay. So kind of when the Yeah. » 08? Okay. So kind of when the Yeah. Facebook made its Yeah. Yeah. I think Facebook made its Yeah. Yeah. I think Facebook made its Yeah. Yeah. I think it's just wild how quickly it changed it's just wild how quickly it changed it's just wild how quickly it changed then around that which would have been then around that which would have been then around that which would have been my senior year. my senior year. my senior year. » Um cuz that's kind of when the iPhone » Um cuz that's kind of when the iPhone » Um cuz that's kind of when the iPhone came out. It's just like a rapid from came out. It's just like a rapid from came out. It's just like a rapid from '09 to now has just been insane in my '09 to now has just been insane in my '09 to now has just been insane in my opinion. just from the cloud to all the opinion. just from the cloud to all the opinion. just from the cloud to all the new technologies to social media. I new technologies to social media. I new technologies to social media. I mean, you're talking about a 15 six well mean, you're talking about a 15 six well mean, you're talking about a 15 six well 16-year sprint that has just been wild. 16-year sprint that has just been wild. 16-year sprint that has just been wild. So, let's jump to that. Um, from that So, let's jump to that. Um, from that So, let's jump to that. Um, from that point, so you'd already had been point, so you'd already had been point, so you'd already had been incorporated for 10 or 11 years. Um, and incorporated for 10 or 11 years. Um, and incorporated for 10 or 11 years. Um, and you start seeing all these companies you start seeing all these companies you start seeing all these companies evolve. You start seeing all these new evolve. You start seeing all these new evolve. You start seeing all these new CRM. it certain company sizes I'm sure CRM. it certain company sizes I'm sure CRM. it certain company sizes I'm sure aren't attractive to you or attracted to aren't attractive to you or attracted to aren't attractive to you or attracted to you just because if they're smaller and you just because if they're smaller and you just because if they're smaller and they're just kind of DIYing it right they're just kind of DIYing it right they're just kind of DIYing it right like in that startup mode like in that startup mode like in that startup mode » certainly » certainly » certainly » right so once they get established what » right so once they get established what » right so once they get established what is that size of business that is like a is that size of business that is like a is that size of business that is like a good fit for IT services probably every good fit for IT services probably every good fit for IT services probably every business needs IT consultation business needs IT consultation business needs IT consultation um but what where do you think a company um but what where do you think a company um but what where do you think a company needs to be to like actually like be on needs to be to like actually like be on needs to be to like actually like be on the radar are for security issues and we the radar are for security issues and we the radar are for security issues and we always talk about that too like if always talk about that too like if always talk about that too like if you're not doing much you're probably you're not doing much you're probably you're not doing much you're probably not a target. Uh is that naive? Is not a target. Uh is that naive? Is not a target. Uh is that naive? Is everybody a target for malware? everybody a target for malware? everybody a target for malware? » I mean everyone is a target but to » I mean everyone is a target but to » I mean everyone is a target but to various degrees. Um I mean just the fact various degrees. Um I mean just the fact various degrees. Um I mean just the fact that you have an online presence. Um that you have an online presence. Um that you have an online presence. Um yeah » you know your computers are connected to » you know your computers are connected to » you know your computers are connected to the internet 24/7. the internet 24/7. the internet 24/7. Um you're certainly a potential target Um you're certainly a potential target Um you're certainly a potential target if nothing else for what we would call if nothing else for what we would call if nothing else for what we would call just a a driveby just a a driveby just a a driveby uh type scenario, right? where you just uh type scenario, right? where you just uh type scenario, right? where you just happen to click on the wrong thing, go happen to click on the wrong thing, go happen to click on the wrong thing, go to the wrong website that serves some to the wrong website that serves some to the wrong website that serves some malicious content or something. Um, and malicious content or something. Um, and malicious content or something. Um, and you know, so everyone's potentially a you know, so everyone's potentially a you know, so everyone's potentially a victim. Um, depending upon the industry victim. Um, depending upon the industry victim. Um, depending upon the industry that you're in, your level of risk that you're in, your level of risk that you're in, your level of risk naturally increases. You know, doctor's naturally increases. You know, doctor's naturally increases. You know, doctor's offices, lawyers, that makes sense, offices, lawyers, that makes sense, offices, lawyers, that makes sense, right? Um, anyone who's working with the right? Um, anyone who's working with the right? Um, anyone who's working with the Department of Defense right now, Department of Defense right now, Department of Defense right now, » right? It's a whole another, » right? It's a whole another, » right? It's a whole another, » right? So, so if you got the secret » right? So, so if you got the secret » right? So, so if you got the secret formula to KFC formula to KFC formula to KFC on your computer, right, then you're on your computer, right, then you're on your computer, right, then you're definitely a target. definitely a target. definitely a target. » Yeah. So, how much of that turned into » Yeah. So, how much of that turned into » Yeah. So, how much of that turned into like security? And I know not that's not like security? And I know not that's not like security? And I know not that's not the you know necessarily you do a lot of the you know necessarily you do a lot of the you know necessarily you do a lot of things but I feel like when people think things but I feel like when people think things but I feel like when people think of it now or in my generation when I of it now or in my generation when I of it now or in my generation when I think of it I think of how can we be think of it I think of how can we be think of it I think of how can we be safe » like when I think of an IT company » like when I think of an IT company » like when I think of an IT company versus hey come fix this router you know versus hey come fix this router you know versus hey come fix this router you know come set this system up and I think come set this system up and I think come set this system up and I think that's still very much probably a core that's still very much probably a core that's still very much probably a core part of your business is still managing part of your business is still managing part of your business is still managing equipment and uh services on software equipment and uh services on software equipment and uh services on software but like how much of your conversations but like how much of your conversations but like how much of your conversations are just around security now versus like are just around security now versus like are just around security now versus like the first 10 years of being in business the first 10 years of being in business the first 10 years of being in business because how fast the internet's changed, because how fast the internet's changed, because how fast the internet's changed, » right? I mean, that's always a a big » right? I mean, that's always a a big » right? I mean, that's always a a big part of the conversation, but I think part of the conversation, but I think part of the conversation, but I think the conversation the conversation the conversation if we attack it from cyber security and if we attack it from cyber security and if we attack it from cyber security and maybe the fear factor associated and maybe the fear factor associated and maybe the fear factor associated with cyber security, you need to protect with cyber security, you need to protect with cyber security, you need to protect yourself from being hacked or whatever yourself from being hacked or whatever yourself from being hacked or whatever type of compromise. Um that is a very type of compromise. Um that is a very type of compromise. Um that is a very difficult topic for most people and very difficult topic for most people and very difficult topic for most people and it's really kind of a three strikes in it's really kind of a three strikes in it's really kind of a three strikes in your out rule. One it's very complicated your out rule. One it's very complicated your out rule. One it's very complicated to understand. People don't like to understand. People don't like to understand. People don't like complicated things to understand because complicated things to understand because complicated things to understand because » you know their business world is » you know their business world is » you know their business world is already complicated trying to run their already complicated trying to run their already complicated trying to run their own business and cyber security own business and cyber security own business and cyber security complications are not something that complications are not something that complications are not something that they want to spend a lot of time on. they want to spend a lot of time on. they want to spend a lot of time on. Secondly, even if you can sell it and Secondly, even if you can sell it and Secondly, even if you can sell it and implement it, it's difficult to implement it, it's difficult to implement it, it's difficult to implement and people don't like implement and people don't like implement and people don't like difficult. And then finally, it's difficult. And then finally, it's difficult. And then finally, it's expensive. So if you really focus just expensive. So if you really focus just expensive. So if you really focus just on cyber security, it can it can spend on cyber security, it can it can spend on cyber security, it can it can spend quite a bit of money doing that. And quite a bit of money doing that. And quite a bit of money doing that. And it's almost like I said, three strikes it's almost like I said, three strikes it's almost like I said, three strikes and you're out. So we really focus more and you're out. So we really focus more and you're out. So we really focus more on the practicality of what needs to be on the practicality of what needs to be on the practicality of what needs to be done. And the technical term for that is done. And the technical term for that is done. And the technical term for that is is uh continuity, right? Business is uh continuity, right? Business is uh continuity, right? Business continuity. So, it's not so much how do continuity. So, it's not so much how do continuity. So, it's not so much how do we get in here and try to protect we get in here and try to protect we get in here and try to protect ourselves, make ourselves Fort Knox, ourselves, make ourselves Fort Knox, ourselves, make ourselves Fort Knox, because chances are you're you're still because chances are you're you're still because chances are you're you're still going to be vulnerable no matter how going to be vulnerable no matter how going to be vulnerable no matter how much money you spend on that. So, the much money you spend on that. So, the much money you spend on that. So, the question is is what do we do in the question is is what do we do in the question is is what do we do in the eventuality that something happens? eventuality that something happens? eventuality that something happens? Because chances are it's not a question Because chances are it's not a question Because chances are it's not a question of of if, it's a question of when. So of of if, it's a question of when. So of of if, it's a question of when. So business continuity just basically means business continuity just basically means business continuity just basically means one are we backing up our data and do we one are we backing up our data and do we one are we backing up our data and do we have it in a place that we can get to it have it in a place that we can get to it have it in a place that we can get to it and then do we have a a well- definfined and then do we have a a well- definfined and then do we have a a well- definfined recovery objective right [snorts] when recovery objective right [snorts] when recovery objective right [snorts] when do we need to be back up and running how do we need to be back up and running how do we need to be back up and running how long can I be down uh before that long can I be down uh before that long can I be down uh before that becomes very detrimental to my business becomes very detrimental to my business becomes very detrimental to my business operations and again depending on the operations and again depending on the operations and again depending on the industry sometimes that's 5 minutes and industry sometimes that's 5 minutes and industry sometimes that's 5 minutes and sometimes that could be 5 days and so Um sometimes that could be 5 days and so Um sometimes that could be 5 days and so Um we basically we focus on those. we basically we focus on those. we basically we focus on those. » That makes sense. So assess like » That makes sense. So assess like » That makes sense. So assess like understand what their uh appetite for understand what their uh appetite for understand what their uh appetite for risk is. Yeah. How much could they be risk is. Yeah. How much could they be risk is. Yeah. How much could they be down? Um so talk so on the ransomware down? Um so talk so on the ransomware down? Um so talk so on the ransomware topic which is you see that in the topic which is you see that in the topic which is you see that in the headlines which has got to be like the headlines which has got to be like the headlines which has got to be like the » I don't know if you're like scared of » I don't know if you're like scared of » I don't know if you're like scared of that. I feel like if I was in your that. I feel like if I was in your that. I feel like if I was in your position, ransomware would keep me awake position, ransomware would keep me awake position, ransomware would keep me awake at night. But I feel like So talk at night. But I feel like So talk at night. But I feel like So talk me through what you can actually control me through what you can actually control me through what you can actually control as an IT as an IT company or any IT as an IT as an IT company or any IT as an IT as an IT company or any IT company. What can they actually control company. What can they actually control company. What can they actually control around ransomware versus operator error? around ransomware versus operator error? around ransomware versus operator error? Cuz you know, I'm thinking of the email Cuz you know, I'm thinking of the email Cuz you know, I'm thinking of the email uh grandma opened and clicked through uh grandma opened and clicked through uh grandma opened and clicked through the link. And even though I've talked to the link. And even though I've talked to the link. And even though I've talked to her about how to prove that, you know, her about how to prove that, you know, her about how to prove that, you know, it's still fairly new and complicated it's still fairly new and complicated it's still fairly new and complicated and there's a trust factor built in, but and there's a trust factor built in, but and there's a trust factor built in, but I assume there's a lot of factors going I assume there's a lot of factors going I assume there's a lot of factors going on that you can't control. on that you can't control. on that you can't control. » Absolutely. And again, I I hesitate to » Absolutely. And again, I I hesitate to » Absolutely. And again, I I hesitate to like pull a statistic because, you know, like pull a statistic because, you know, like pull a statistic because, you know, No. Yeah. No. Yeah. No. Yeah. » 99% of all statistics are made up on the » 99% of all statistics are made up on the » 99% of all statistics are made up on the fly anyway, including fly anyway, including fly anyway, including » Let's make a new one. We're going to » Let's make a new one. We're going to » Let's make a new one. We're going to call it the JD ransomware statistic. But call it the JD ransomware statistic. But call it the JD ransomware statistic. But the majority of of mistakes that happen the majority of of mistakes that happen the majority of of mistakes that happen and the m majority of vulnerabilities and the m majority of vulnerabilities and the m majority of vulnerabilities that we see are human. And so it's that we see are human. And so it's that we see are human. And so it's really unfair a little bit, Sam, to just really unfair a little bit, Sam, to just really unfair a little bit, Sam, to just uh kind of conceptualize that as like uh kind of conceptualize that as like uh kind of conceptualize that as like it's my grandma who's the problem, it's my grandma who's the problem, it's my grandma who's the problem, right? [clears throat] right? [clears throat] right? [clears throat] » Um because I I don't think the age » Um because I I don't think the age » Um because I I don't think the age demographics or anything like that, demographics or anything like that, demographics or anything like that, » education levels, experience has much to » education levels, experience has much to » education levels, experience has much to do with it. do with it. do with it. » I and I'll I'll say this right now, my » I and I'll I'll say this right now, my » I and I'll I'll say this right now, my grandma's done it. I have done it. grandma's done it. I have done it. grandma's done it. I have done it. I I have been caught on a uh I I have been caught on a uh I I have been caught on a uh scam uh with crypto and they remade a scam uh with crypto and they remade a scam uh with crypto and they remade a website. It was super embarrassing, but website. It was super embarrassing, but website. It was super embarrassing, but I went into a website that I was told to I went into a website that I was told to I went into a website that I was told to go to and uh connected my wallet, go to and uh connected my wallet, go to and uh connected my wallet, drained my wallet, it was all gone. And drained my wallet, it was all gone. And drained my wallet, it was all gone. And so it's it's getting it's changing all so it's it's getting it's changing all so it's it's getting it's changing all the time. I feel like it's you catch on the time. I feel like it's you catch on the time. I feel like it's you catch on to a tactic and then if you're kind of to a tactic and then if you're kind of to a tactic and then if you're kind of the first to be caught on a new tactic, the first to be caught on a new tactic, the first to be caught on a new tactic, you know, then you tell the world you're you know, then you tell the world you're you know, then you tell the world you're like, "Oh, they got me. This is how they like, "Oh, they got me. This is how they like, "Oh, they got me. This is how they got me. Sure. But it is like it's like got me. Sure. But it is like it's like got me. Sure. But it is like it's like marketing in a sense and there's some marketing in a sense and there's some marketing in a sense and there's some creativity around ransomware. creativity around ransomware. creativity around ransomware. » Absolutely. » Absolutely. » Absolutely. » Where they're getting like it just seems » Where they're getting like it just seems » Where they're getting like it just seems like they're getting really good at it. like they're getting really good at it. like they're getting really good at it. » It absolutely they are because there are » It absolutely they are because there are » It absolutely they are because there are billions or trillions of dollars that billions or trillions of dollars that billions or trillions of dollars that are being stolen every year, are being stolen every year, are being stolen every year, » right? With with cyber security attacks. » right? With with cyber security attacks. » right? With with cyber security attacks. And so several years ago when And so several years ago when And so several years ago when hacking and that kind of thing first hacking and that kind of thing first hacking and that kind of thing first started being a problem um we talked started being a problem um we talked started being a problem um we talked about things we called them script about things we called them script about things we called them script kitties. So high school kids right kitties. So high school kids right kitties. So high school kids right downloading code off of the internet and downloading code off of the internet and downloading code off of the internet and playing around and trying to see kind of playing around and trying to see kind of playing around and trying to see kind of the war game scenario right you know the war game scenario right you know the war game scenario right you know the old movie which probably came out before old movie which probably came out before old movie which probably came out before you were born but you were born but you were born but » I know what you're talking » I know what you're talking » I know what you're talking about. But that old movie, you know, but about. But that old movie, you know, but about. But that old movie, you know, but the idea was just, you know, kids in the idea was just, you know, kids in the idea was just, you know, kids in their basement goofing off, not really their basement goofing off, not really their basement goofing off, not really trying to to hurt anybody, but just trying to to hurt anybody, but just trying to to hurt anybody, but just trying to see what they could get into trying to see what they could get into trying to see what they could get into and what they could do and that kind of and what they could do and that kind of and what they could do and that kind of thing. thing. thing. » Um, but that concept is is very » Um, but that concept is is very » Um, but that concept is is very antiquated and dead, right? With the antiquated and dead, right? With the antiquated and dead, right? With the with the money that's out there today with the money that's out there today with the money that's out there today that people are stealing, um, these are that people are stealing, um, these are that people are stealing, um, these are very sophisticated criminals. Um, and very sophisticated criminals. Um, and very sophisticated criminals. Um, and they play psychological games and they play psychological games and they play psychological games and they are very good at it. These guys could are very good at it. These guys could are very good at it. These guys could probably work for like the Israeli spy probably work for like the Israeli spy probably work for like the Israeli spy government, right? Because they uh government, right? Because they uh government, right? Because they uh they're just that good. And they can they're just that good. And they can they're just that good. And they can trick any one of us on any given day. trick any one of us on any given day. trick any one of us on any given day. All you really have to do is be at a All you really have to do is be at a All you really have to do is be at a time when you're you're busy or you're, time when you're you're busy or you're, time when you're you're busy or you're, you know, you're concentrating on you know, you're concentrating on you know, you're concentrating on something else and uh they're just going something else and uh they're just going something else and uh they're just going to catch you on a whale. that's the to catch you on a whale. that's the to catch you on a whale. that's the case. If it's people that could be case. If it's people that could be case. If it's people that could be distracted or struggling with distracted or struggling with distracted or struggling with multitasking, I'm their target. multitasking, I'm their target. multitasking, I'm their target. » Like, if there's anyone they should be » Like, if there's anyone they should be » Like, if there's anyone they should be targeting, it's me. targeting, it's me. targeting, it's me. » Well, I mean, even just to get an like » Well, I mean, even just to get an like » Well, I mean, even just to get an like an email that I get all the time for an email that I get all the time for an email that I get all the time for someone to take the effort to recreate someone to take the effort to recreate someone to take the effort to recreate that email template, right? Those are that email template, right? Those are that email template, right? Those are the scary ones. And I have to be really the scary ones. And I have to be really the scary ones. And I have to be really careful because I can just be like, "Oh, careful because I can just be like, "Oh, careful because I can just be like, "Oh, yeah. Let me authorize that real quick." yeah. Let me authorize that real quick." yeah. Let me authorize that real quick." you know, or if it's a authentification you know, or if it's a authentification you know, or if it's a authentification code like that comes in, you know, and code like that comes in, you know, and code like that comes in, you know, and they remake it and it's like, but send they remake it and it's like, but send they remake it and it's like, but send it here like I know where it's going to it here like I know where it's going to it here like I know where it's going to go or the person, but it is like I think go or the person, but it is like I think go or the person, but it is like I think it's very easy to be distracted and it's very easy to be distracted and it's very easy to be distracted and especially if they put some effort into especially if they put some effort into especially if they put some effort into it. Now, some are really bad. You're it. Now, some are really bad. You're it. Now, some are really bad. You're like, come on, dude. Like AI could have like, come on, dude. Like AI could have like, come on, dude. Like AI could have designed those graphics better on that designed those graphics better on that designed those graphics better on that email template to look more like email template to look more like email template to look more like Facebook than what you did. Um, back Facebook than what you did. Um, back Facebook than what you did. Um, back to that original point though, tell back to that original point though, tell back to that original point though, tell me what you think your job is to help me what you think your job is to help me what you think your job is to help with ransomware like as an IT company. with ransomware like as an IT company. with ransomware like as an IT company. » Like what? Yeah. » Like what? Yeah. » Like what? Yeah. » So again, I think my job is to go in and » So again, I think my job is to go in and » So again, I think my job is to go in and understand what is the worst case understand what is the worst case understand what is the worst case scenario. scenario. scenario. » Okay. [clears throat] » Okay. [clears throat] » Okay. [clears throat] » So if you get affected by a ransomware » So if you get affected by a ransomware » So if you get affected by a ransomware virus and you don't catch it in time and virus and you don't catch it in time and virus and you don't catch it in time and it encrypts all of your data. it encrypts all of your data. it encrypts all of your data. » Mhm. » Mhm. » Mhm. » Right. Then what is the worst case » Right. Then what is the worst case » Right. Then what is the worst case scenario of that? Is it is it that scenario of that? Is it is it that scenario of that? Is it is it that you've lost the data and you had a um you've lost the data and you had a um you've lost the data and you had a um you had a legal requirement to keep that you had a legal requirement to keep that you had a legal requirement to keep that data and so you need to recover it? Is data and so you need to recover it? Is data and so you need to recover it? Is it because you're AWS and millions or it because you're AWS and millions or it because you're AWS and millions or billions of people around the world are billions of people around the world are billions of people around the world are » rely on you » rely on you » rely on you » relying on you and so you have to get » relying on you and so you have to get » relying on you and so you have to get that service back up line or if you have that service back up line or if you have that service back up line or if you have a you know a book auction that um a you know a book auction that um a you know a book auction that um operates something like eBay, operates something like eBay, operates something like eBay, » right? Yeah. » right? Yeah. » right? Yeah. So, you know, it's it's the what we need So, you know, it's it's the what we need So, you know, it's it's the what we need to do is determine what's the worst case to do is determine what's the worst case to do is determine what's the worst case scenario and then how do we mitigate scenario and then how do we mitigate scenario and then how do we mitigate that worst case scenario. So, if you that worst case scenario. So, if you that worst case scenario. So, if you need more uptime because you got need more uptime because you got need more uptime because you got attacked with um you know with a attacked with um you know with a attacked with um you know with a ransomware virus, then how do we ransomware virus, then how do we ransomware virus, then how do we engineer something on the back end? How engineer something on the back end? How engineer something on the back end? How do we create a backup solution that is do we create a backup solution that is do we create a backup solution that is scalable to your business, right? But scalable to your business, right? But scalable to your business, right? But it's also isolated so that it doesn't it's also isolated so that it doesn't it's also isolated so that it doesn't get attacked during the same malware get attacked during the same malware get attacked during the same malware attack so that we can get you back up attack so that we can get you back up attack so that we can get you back up and running. and running. and running. » Yep. No, it makes sense. How much » Yep. No, it makes sense. How much » Yep. No, it makes sense. How much education comes into that as well? Are education comes into that as well? Are education comes into that as well? Are you guys do you offer education for you guys do you offer education for you guys do you offer education for personnel or documentation saying or do personnel or documentation saying or do personnel or documentation saying or do they have someone in house doing that? they have someone in house doing that? they have someone in house doing that? Like, hey, if you get an email like Like, hey, if you get an email like Like, hey, if you get an email like here's your steps before you proceed here's your steps before you proceed here's your steps before you proceed with something. um or what they're with something. um or what they're with something. um or what they're allowed to access on a work computer allowed to access on a work computer allowed to access on a work computer versus a personal computer. Um is that versus a personal computer. Um is that versus a personal computer. Um is that at all IT company's responsibility or is at all IT company's responsibility or is at all IT company's responsibility or is that someone in house? that someone in house? that someone in house? » Well, I think ultimately it's just the » Well, I think ultimately it's just the » Well, I think ultimately it's just the business owner's responsibility. business owner's responsibility. business owner's responsibility. Um some companies will pay for training, Um some companies will pay for training, Um some companies will pay for training, some companies won't. The bigger they some companies won't. The bigger they some companies won't. The bigger they are, the more likely they are, the more are, the more likely they are, the more are, the more likely they are, the more sensitive data that they handle or the sensitive data that they handle or the sensitive data that they handle or the more risk that they perceive they have, more risk that they perceive they have, more risk that they perceive they have, the more willing they are to pay for the more willing they are to pay for the more willing they are to pay for that. Um, most of that training, I that. Um, most of that training, I that. Um, most of that training, I think, these days comes from online think, these days comes from online think, these days comes from online services that uh do fishing campaigns to services that uh do fishing campaigns to services that uh do fishing campaigns to see if they can catch you and uh send see if they can catch you and uh send see if they can catch you and uh send out educational videos and emails and out educational videos and emails and out educational videos and emails and that kind of thing. that kind of thing. that kind of thing. » Um, but again, bigger corporations will » Um, but again, bigger corporations will » Um, but again, bigger corporations will actually make people go to a mandatory actually make people go to a mandatory actually make people go to a mandatory training session. training session. training session. » Got once a year, once every six months, » Got once a year, once every six months, » Got once a year, once every six months, something to that effect. something to that effect. something to that effect. » So, let's do a let's do a thought » So, let's do a let's do a thought » So, let's do a let's do a thought process. I think it'd be kind of fun. process. I think it'd be kind of fun. process. I think it'd be kind of fun. So, let's break down this business, the So, let's break down this business, the So, let's break down this business, the building you're in. I just gave you a building you're in. I just gave you a building you're in. I just gave you a tour » of the book business. All right. So, we » of the book business. All right. So, we » of the book business. All right. So, we sell Right. So, we sell new books, used sell Right. So, we sell new books, used sell Right. So, we sell new books, used books on third party platforms, uh eBay, books on third party platforms, uh eBay, books on third party platforms, uh eBay, Amazon, uh Aves Books, we have our own Amazon, uh Aves Books, we have our own Amazon, uh Aves Books, we have our own Shopify store. Uh we sell on whatnot Shopify store. Uh we sell on whatnot Shopify store. Uh we sell on whatnot doing live auctions and then we also doing live auctions and then we also doing live auctions and then we also sell on Tik Tok. Uh doing live auctions sell on Tik Tok. Uh doing live auctions sell on Tik Tok. Uh doing live auctions on Tik Tok. So, we sell across on Tik Tok. So, we sell across on Tik Tok. So, we sell across platforms. Uh obviously we access all of platforms. Uh obviously we access all of platforms. Uh obviously we access all of those have their own login and certain those have their own login and certain those have their own login and certain people in here can access the back end people in here can access the back end people in here can access the back end of these third party platforms. Some of these third party platforms. Some of these third party platforms. Some can't. I'm trying to think of all the can't. I'm trying to think of all the can't. I'm trying to think of all the other accesses like you know we access other accesses like you know we access other accesses like you know we access other you know you access your bank other you know you access your bank other you know you access your bank account in this building. Uh you access account in this building. Uh you access account in this building. Uh you access QuickBooks in this building. Um but how QuickBooks in this building. Um but how QuickBooks in this building. Um but how what take me through like if I'm like what take me through like if I'm like what take me through like if I'm like okay hey I'm meeting with essential it okay hey I'm meeting with essential it okay hey I'm meeting with essential it uh and ask me some questions about that uh and ask me some questions about that uh and ask me some questions about that business reliant uh what would be business reliant uh what would be business reliant uh what would be your questions dialogue with me to do a your questions dialogue with me to do a your questions dialogue with me to do a discovery in a sense of like what are discovery in a sense of like what are discovery in a sense of like what are our where are we exposed what are our where are we exposed what are our where are we exposed what are problems we might face what are things problems we might face what are things problems we might face what are things we haven't thought of to see if you can we haven't thought of to see if you can we haven't thought of to see if you can help us or if we are vulnerable or help us or if we are vulnerable or help us or if we are vulnerable or identify what would be the biggest risk identify what would be the biggest risk identify what would be the biggest risk if something happened if something happened if something happened » okay well I think my first question » okay well I think my first question » okay well I think my first question would just be what's your take on on would just be what's your take on on would just be what's your take on on cyber security, right? Are you kind of a cyber security, right? Are you kind of a cyber security, right? Are you kind of a conservative person? Like we we don't conservative person? Like we we don't conservative person? Like we we don't really think it's going to help us at really think it's going to help us at really think it's going to help us at all and so it'd be just a a waste of all and so it'd be just a a waste of all and so it'd be just a a waste of money that we're going to pour down the money that we're going to pour down the money that we're going to pour down the drain and we're inevitably going to get drain and we're inevitably going to get drain and we're inevitably going to get hit anyway or are you more of like, hey, hit anyway or are you more of like, hey, hit anyway or are you more of like, hey, we really want to spend a million we really want to spend a million we really want to spend a million dollars on this kind of thing. Um so it dollars on this kind of thing. Um so it dollars on this kind of thing. Um so it kind of gives me a framework of where kind of gives me a framework of where kind of gives me a framework of where you're at. Where do you want to be? What you're at. Where do you want to be? What you're at. Where do you want to be? What are your concerns? How big of a risk do are your concerns? How big of a risk do are your concerns? How big of a risk do you think it is? you think it is? you think it is? » Yeah, that's a thing I don't fully » Yeah, that's a thing I don't fully » Yeah, that's a thing I don't fully understand. Probably for that business understand. Probably for that business understand. Probably for that business unit. The risk I would see is unit. The risk I would see is unit. The risk I would see is um I'm I'm definitely not on a don't do um I'm I'm definitely not on a don't do um I'm I'm definitely not on a don't do anything. I would say I'm somewhere in anything. I would say I'm somewhere in anything. I would say I'm somewhere in the middle of assessing what could the middle of assessing what could the middle of assessing what could actually happen. [clears throat] actually happen. [clears throat] actually happen. [clears throat] So, I I would say I'm I'm nervous about So, I I would say I'm I'm nervous about So, I I would say I'm I'm nervous about who has access, what are they able to who has access, what are they able to who has access, what are they able to do. Um I think that's a liability. uh if do. Um I think that's a liability. uh if do. Um I think that's a liability. uh if somebody were to come in because we have somebody were to come in because we have somebody were to come in because we have a lot of vendors. So, we also have a ton a lot of vendors. So, we also have a ton a lot of vendors. So, we also have a ton of vendor transactions happening uh over of vendor transactions happening uh over of vendor transactions happening uh over email and conversations um there. email and conversations um there. email and conversations um there. » So, I think we could be fished on like a » So, I think we could be fished on like a » So, I think we could be fished on like a fake shipment. Like I could see someone fake shipment. Like I could see someone fake shipment. Like I could see someone coming in doing that. Um which kind of coming in doing that. Um which kind of coming in doing that. Um which kind of comes down to the buyer, which is my comes down to the buyer, which is my comes down to the buyer, which is my brother. Like he's got to make sure that brother. Like he's got to make sure that brother. Like he's got to make sure that it's legit and it's the same guy cuz he it's legit and it's the same guy cuz he it's legit and it's the same guy cuz he does wire money to people, right? um he does wire money to people, right? um he does wire money to people, right? um he wires money to some of these uh outlets wires money to some of these uh outlets wires money to some of these uh outlets that we take care of their liquidation that we take care of their liquidation that we take care of their liquidation inventory. inventory. inventory. » Um and making sure that's the same guy » Um and making sure that's the same guy » Um and making sure that's the same guy that he bought from last time and it's that he bought from last time and it's that he bought from last time and it's not someone else, which I don't know how not someone else, which I don't know how not someone else, which I don't know how that would even happen, but uh I would that would even happen, but uh I would that would even happen, but uh I would say like access is probably the thing I say like access is probably the thing I say like access is probably the thing I would want to invest into and protecting would want to invest into and protecting would want to invest into and protecting access. access. access. » Okay, does that make sense? to the » Okay, does that make sense? to the » Okay, does that make sense? to the various websites various websites various websites » to to all the platforms because I think » to to all the platforms because I think » to to all the platforms because I think our biggest liability would just be yeah our biggest liability would just be yeah our biggest liability would just be yeah I would say I'm not conservative as in I would say I'm not conservative as in I would say I'm not conservative as in like it'll never happen to us or if it like it'll never happen to us or if it like it'll never happen to us or if it does so be it like that would be does so be it like that would be does so be it like that would be terrible. Um because we've lost access terrible. Um because we've lost access terrible. Um because we've lost access and for example actually we just lost and for example actually we just lost and for example actually we just lost access to our Facebook account and we access to our Facebook account and we access to our Facebook account and we can't figure it out. Someone took over can't figure it out. Someone took over can't figure it out. Someone took over our Facebook accountant our Facebook accountant our Facebook accountant Facebook account. Go give it a follow. Facebook account. Go give it a follow. Facebook account. Go give it a follow. It's blowing up right now. It's all AI It's blowing up right now. It's all AI It's blowing up right now. It's all AI generated videos of animals and it's generated videos of animals and it's generated videos of animals and it's honestly a way better experience now honestly a way better experience now honestly a way better experience now than how we ran the Facebook account. than how we ran the Facebook account. than how we ran the Facebook account. If you ask around town, If you ask around town, If you ask around town, they're all really entertained, but they're all really entertained, but they're all really entertained, but literally we have no idea how it literally we have no idea how it literally we have no idea how it happened. We don't know if someone happened. We don't know if someone happened. We don't know if someone clicked into an email. clicked into an email. clicked into an email. » Um like accounts that have access to » Um like accounts that have access to » Um like accounts that have access to other accounts, none of the other ones other accounts, none of the other ones other accounts, none of the other ones were compromised, but that one's just were compromised, but that one's just were compromised, but that one's just literally it's like we never had access literally it's like we never had access literally it's like we never had access to it out of nowhere. It's a weird deal. to it out of nowhere. It's a weird deal. to it out of nowhere. It's a weird deal. Um, Um, Um, » so like that'd be an example of if » so like that'd be an example of if » so like that'd be an example of if someone got access or took over our someone got access or took over our someone got access or took over our Amazon account, right? Or somehow we're Amazon account, right? Or somehow we're Amazon account, right? Or somehow we're able to get in there, change the able to get in there, change the able to get in there, change the password, and we can't touch Amazon and password, and we can't touch Amazon and password, and we can't touch Amazon and then was able to change where the payout then was able to change where the payout then was able to change where the payout went to, went to, went to, » that would be a huge risk for us because » that would be a huge risk for us because » that would be a huge risk for us because if they can change where the bank if they can change where the bank if they can change where the bank account's routing to inside a third account's routing to inside a third account's routing to inside a third party account like an Amazon or party account like an Amazon or party account like an Amazon or something, that would that would something, that would that would something, that would that would suck. Like, okay, suck. Like, okay, suck. Like, okay, » I I would want to avoid that. So there's » I I would want to avoid that. So there's » I I would want to avoid that. So there's there's two basic paths that we could go there's two basic paths that we could go there's two basic paths that we could go down here. And the one that I think down here. And the one that I think down here. And the one that I think most IT people would jump on would be most IT people would jump on would be most IT people would jump on would be password protections, right? Are you password protections, right? Are you password protections, right? Are you using some kind of password keeper using some kind of password keeper using some kind of password keeper software? Yeah. software? Yeah. software? Yeah. » You know, are you are you making sure » You know, are you are you making sure » You know, are you are you making sure that everybody's enforcing that? Are you that everybody's enforcing that? Are you that everybody's enforcing that? Are you using multifactor authentication? Are using multifactor authentication? Are using multifactor authentication? Are using complicated passwords? And so, you using complicated passwords? And so, you using complicated passwords? And so, you know, the advantage of using a password know, the advantage of using a password know, the advantage of using a password keeper software, um, you can generate keeper software, um, you can generate keeper software, um, you can generate 30digit or 40digit, you know, long 30digit or 40digit, you know, long 30digit or 40digit, you know, long random passwords and not have to worry random passwords and not have to worry random passwords and not have to worry about memorizing those or keying those about memorizing those or keying those about memorizing those or keying those in. And I think most IT people are going in. And I think most IT people are going in. And I think most IT people are going to go down that path. Um, and I I think to go down that path. Um, and I I think to go down that path. Um, and I I think that, you know, they're going to bring that, you know, they're going to bring that, you know, they're going to bring out their toolbox and they're out their toolbox and they're out their toolbox and they're going to show you a shiny tool and say, going to show you a shiny tool and say, going to show you a shiny tool and say, "We have the best password keeper in the "We have the best password keeper in the "We have the best password keeper in the world, right? and uh we can protect you world, right? and uh we can protect you world, right? and uh we can protect you from that thing. We would take a little from that thing. We would take a little from that thing. We would take a little bit different tack with that. My my bit different tack with that. My my bit different tack with that. My my thought is to come back to first of all thought is to come back to first of all thought is to come back to first of all um you know there's there's people here um you know there's there's people here um you know there's there's people here and so we need to really be managing the and so we need to really be managing the and so we need to really be managing the people more than we're managing the people more than we're managing the people more than we're managing the technologies. So my question would be technologies. So my question would be technologies. So my question would be what kind of policies and procedures do what kind of policies and procedures do what kind of policies and procedures do you have in place? So are you have in place? So are you have in place? So are you controlling by policy who has access to controlling by policy who has access to controlling by policy who has access to which websites and when? Um are we are which websites and when? Um are we are which websites and when? Um are we are we having policies? Do we have policies we having policies? Do we have policies we having policies? Do we have policies in place that say we will use unique in place that say we will use unique in place that say we will use unique passwords for every different site? Um passwords for every different site? Um passwords for every different site? Um how do we decide who gets access to this how do we decide who gets access to this how do we decide who gets access to this site and what level of permissions they site and what level of permissions they site and what level of permissions they get into that site and are we auditing get into that site and are we auditing get into that site and are we auditing that from time to time and you know even that from time to time and you know even that from time to time and you know even in a small organization people leave in a small organization people leave in a small organization people leave people come and go. We hire people we people come and go. We hire people we people come and go. We hire people we leave we you know other people leave we you know other people leave we you know other people terminate. So, do we have a practice in terminate. So, do we have a practice in terminate. So, do we have a practice in place, right? We have a policy and a place, right? We have a policy and a place, right? We have a policy and a procedure that dictates what we do when procedure that dictates what we do when procedure that dictates what we do when we release someone, we release someone, we release someone, » right? Do we take their access back or » right? Do we take their access back or » right? Do we take their access back or do we just leave it out there? Are we do we just leave it out there? Are we do we just leave it out there? Are we aware of what passwords they knew aware of what passwords they knew aware of what passwords they knew » and what access they had that were » and what access they had that were » and what access they had that were potentially compromising to us? And so potentially compromising to us? And so potentially compromising to us? And so we're just going to want to take a we're just going to want to take a we're just going to want to take a little bit different tack with that and little bit different tack with that and little bit different tack with that and say before we go spend a million dollars say before we go spend a million dollars say before we go spend a million dollars on fixing this problem, let's make sure on fixing this problem, let's make sure on fixing this problem, let's make sure that we have the underlying business that we have the underlying business that we have the underlying business processes and policies in place to processes and policies in place to processes and policies in place to protect ourselves. protect ourselves. protect ourselves. » Yeah, that's really good because it » Yeah, that's really good because it » Yeah, that's really good because it doesn't matter if you use one password doesn't matter if you use one password doesn't matter if you use one password if you don't have a policy around like if you don't have a policy around like if you don't have a policy around like the hierarchy of who has access to that, the hierarchy of who has access to that, the hierarchy of who has access to that, how are things adjusted, changed. how are things adjusted, changed. how are things adjusted, changed. » Yes. If everyone's an administrator, » Yes. If everyone's an administrator, » Yes. If everyone's an administrator, » right? I mean that's that's bad, right? » right? I mean that's that's bad, right? » right? I mean that's that's bad, right? And but you would be And but you would be And but you would be surprised how much that happens. Um and surprised how much that happens. Um and surprised how much that happens. Um and I work with business owners and this I work with business owners and this I work with business owners and this is our thing. We don't judge, right? We is our thing. We don't judge, right? We is our thing. We don't judge, right? We don't tell people you can do this or don't tell people you can do this or don't tell people you can do this or can't do this. And so early when you can't do this. And so early when you can't do this. And so early when you asked about responsibility is this it's asked about responsibility is this it's asked about responsibility is this it's responsibility or you know an in-house responsibility or you know an in-house responsibility or you know an in-house responsibility. It really difficult for responsibility. It really difficult for responsibility. It really difficult for us to assume it responsibility and say us to assume it responsibility and say us to assume it responsibility and say it is the savior of the world. it is the savior of the world. it is the savior of the world. Um our philosophy is more that um we are Um our philosophy is more that um we are Um our philosophy is more that um we are a repertoire of knowledge right we have a repertoire of knowledge right we have a repertoire of knowledge right we have experiences in different industries and experiences in different industries and experiences in different industries and for many years and our job is to bring for many years and our job is to bring for many years and our job is to bring information to the table right we want information to the table right we want information to the table right we want business owners to know how it affects business owners to know how it affects business owners to know how it affects their business and what they need to their business and what they need to their business and what they need to know to make good business decisions know to make good business decisions know to make good business decisions about that. So we coined this thing we about that. So we coined this thing we about that. So we coined this thing we call the EIT method, right? Um we call the EIT method, right? Um we call the EIT method, right? Um we inform, inform, inform, » right? And then the business owner » right? And then the business owner » right? And then the business owner decides what to do and then we come in decides what to do and then we come in decides what to do and then we come in and we say we cheerfully implement their and we say we cheerfully implement their and we say we cheerfully implement their decisions. And we we say cheerfully on decisions. And we we say cheerfully on decisions. And we we say cheerfully on purpose. It's an intentional word purpose. It's an intentional word purpose. It's an intentional word because we again we don't judge and we because we again we don't judge and we because we again we don't judge and we don't think we're smarter than you. You don't think we're smarter than you. You don't think we're smarter than you. You know your business. you know your know your business. you know your know your business. you know your bookstore business better than I your bookstore business better than I your bookstore business better than I could ever know it, could ever know it, could ever know it, » right? Um I think we know it better than » right? Um I think we know it better than » right? Um I think we know it better than you should have to. you should have to. you should have to. » Yeah, there you go. » Yeah, there you go. » Yeah, there you go. » And so we just want to help you make » And so we just want to help you make » And so we just want to help you make better decisions with that. So when you better decisions with that. So when you better decisions with that. So when you ask me questions like, you know, what ask me questions like, you know, what ask me questions like, you know, what should I be focusing on on cyber should I be focusing on on cyber should I be focusing on on cyber security and say, well, the first step security and say, well, the first step security and say, well, the first step is policies and procedures, making sure is policies and procedures, making sure is policies and procedures, making sure that we're just not setting ourselves up that we're just not setting ourselves up that we're just not setting ourselves up to be vulnerable on something that we to be vulnerable on something that we to be vulnerable on something that we can't control. can't control. can't control. » Yeah. So my job is to inform and then I » Yeah. So my job is to inform and then I » Yeah. So my job is to inform and then I just wait for you to decide. just wait for you to decide. just wait for you to decide. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Right. And you tell me what you think is » Right. And you tell me what you think is » Right. And you tell me what you think is best for your business. Right. And then best for your business. Right. And then best for your business. Right. And then we're going to come in and cheerfully we're going to come in and cheerfully we're going to come in and cheerfully implement that. Right. We we're not so implement that. Right. We we're not so implement that. Right. We we're not so egotistical to think we know better than egotistical to think we know better than egotistical to think we know better than you. So we're not condescending. Yeah. you. So we're not condescending. Yeah. you. So we're not condescending. Yeah. » We're not mad because you didn't choose » We're not mad because you didn't choose » We're not mad because you didn't choose the solution that we chose for you. the solution that we chose for you. the solution that we chose for you. Right. We let you choose a decision. And Right. We let you choose a decision. And Right. We let you choose a decision. And we think that people are pretty good we think that people are pretty good we think that people are pretty good about making good decisions if they know about making good decisions if they know about making good decisions if they know all the information. So all the information. So all the information. So » yeah, that's really good. Kind of sounds » yeah, that's really good. Kind of sounds » yeah, that's really good. Kind of sounds like how I wish our political system like how I wish our political system like how I wish our political system works. works. works. » Wow. » Wow. » Wow. » So hey, » So hey, » So hey, » that's a whole another conversation. » that's a whole another conversation. » that's a whole another conversation. We're not going to go down there. We're not going to go down there. We're not going to go down there. » So first data centers, now politics. So » So first data centers, now politics. So » So first data centers, now politics. So uh hey, when do we get into religion? uh hey, when do we get into religion? uh hey, when do we get into religion? Because Because Because » I'm ready for that, too. » I'm ready for that, too. » I'm ready for that, too. » I'm ready. Let's go. » I'm ready. Let's go. » I'm ready. Let's go. » No, that's really good. I uh so I've » No, that's really good. I uh so I've » No, that's really good. I uh so I've known JD for gosh it's coming a it's got known JD for gosh it's coming a it's got known JD for gosh it's coming a it's got to be a year now. to be a year now. to be a year now. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Right at a year now. And uh we're in the » Right at a year now. And uh we're in the » Right at a year now. And uh we're in the same uh BNI group and that's kind of how same uh BNI group and that's kind of how same uh BNI group and that's kind of how we got to know each other. And uh you do we got to know each other. And uh you do we got to know each other. And uh you do all of our education moments and what all of our education moments and what all of our education moments and what was yesterday's by the way cuz I didn't was yesterday's by the way cuz I didn't was yesterday's by the way cuz I didn't do do do » I basically tied in uh so Sunday is the » I basically tied in uh so Sunday is the » I basically tied in uh so Sunday is the birthday of the uh United States Postal birthday of the uh United States Postal birthday of the uh United States Postal Service » and so I I did a a quick uh recap on » and so I I did a a quick uh recap on » and so I I did a a quick uh recap on some of the interesting facts around the some of the interesting facts around the some of the interesting facts around the uh postal service in the history of the uh postal service in the history of the uh postal service in the history of the world. world. world. » Okay. » Okay. » Okay. » Right. And uh then kind of tied that » Right. And uh then kind of tied that » Right. And uh then kind of tied that back into a BNI lesson. Gotcha. Yeah. back into a BNI lesson. Gotcha. Yeah. back into a BNI lesson. Gotcha. Yeah. And those lessons are always great. And those lessons are always great. And those lessons are always great. And what I appreciate about them is when you what I appreciate about them is when you what I appreciate about them is when you see someone do something uh repetitive see someone do something uh repetitive see someone do something uh repetitive or in a organizational role or anything, or in a organizational role or anything, or in a organizational role or anything, you kind of get a vibe for probably how you kind of get a vibe for probably how you kind of get a vibe for probably how they run their business or how they talk they run their business or how they talk they run their business or how they talk to people. to people. to people. » And I don't think I've ever told you » And I don't think I've ever told you » And I don't think I've ever told you this, but when I see that, I go, "Oh, I this, but when I see that, I go, "Oh, I this, but when I see that, I go, "Oh, I can tell JD really loves the consulting can tell JD really loves the consulting can tell JD really loves the consulting side of his business." Like, he really side of his business." Like, he really side of his business." Like, he really loves unraveling what's going on. you're loves unraveling what's going on. you're loves unraveling what's going on. you're not there to sell them something they not there to sell them something they not there to sell them something they don't need. You're genuinely there to be don't need. You're genuinely there to be don't need. You're genuinely there to be a partner and you've talked about being a partner and you've talked about being a partner and you've talked about being a growth partner um when I first came a growth partner um when I first came a growth partner um when I first came into the group and you've you where you into the group and you've you where you into the group and you've you where you essentially talked about how could a it essentially talked about how could a it essentially talked about how could a it actually grow your business. How could actually grow your business. How could actually grow your business. How could it make your business more profitable it make your business more profitable it make your business more profitable and so you take a much bigger approach and so you take a much bigger approach and so you take a much bigger approach than I think what the traditional view than I think what the traditional view than I think what the traditional view of it is and I I appreciate that. I of it is and I I appreciate that. I of it is and I I appreciate that. I think that's a a powerful thing and just think that's a a powerful thing and just think that's a a powerful thing and just what you did right there. I'm sitting what you did right there. I'm sitting what you did right there. I'm sitting here going crap. Yeah, we have this one here going crap. Yeah, we have this one here going crap. Yeah, we have this one password. I already know I already know password. I already know I already know password. I already know I already know who doesn't use it. And I'm also who doesn't use it. And I'm also who doesn't use it. And I'm also thinking, yeah, I guarantee you that thinking, yeah, I guarantee you that thinking, yeah, I guarantee you that there's no policy and leadership over there's no policy and leadership over there's no policy and leadership over there of where to put it, you know? And there of where to put it, you know? And there of where to put it, you know? And so then that comes back to where I would so then that comes back to where I would so then that comes back to where I would naturally say, hey, how would that naturally say, hey, how would that naturally say, hey, how would that work? Like no one here is going to get work? Like no one here is going to get work? Like no one here is going to get that done. Like could you guys come in that done. Like could you guys come in that done. Like could you guys come in and help write the policies, understand and help write the policies, understand and help write the policies, understand our systems? our systems? our systems? » Absolutely. » Absolutely. » Absolutely. » And assist on that. I'm assuming that's » And assist on that. I'm assuming that's » And assist on that. I'm assuming that's kind of where it would go next would be. kind of where it would go next would be. kind of where it would go next would be. » Yeah. That's what we would really do. » Yeah. That's what we would really do. » Yeah. That's what we would really do. And the first thing we would do would be And the first thing we would do would be And the first thing we would do would be to offer you a free 30 minute, 45 minute to offer you a free 30 minute, 45 minute to offer you a free 30 minute, 45 minute business assessment. business assessment. business assessment. » That's what this is, you know, » That's what this is, you know, » That's what this is, you know, » right? Where we want to come in, right, » right? Where we want to come in, right, » right? Where we want to come in, right, publicly, right? Where we want to come publicly, right? Where we want to come publicly, right? Where we want to come in and just understand a little bit more in and just understand a little bit more in and just understand a little bit more about your business um and how it about your business um and how it about your business um and how it operates. And I I have an analogy for operates. And I I have an analogy for operates. And I I have an analogy for that I I really just can't wait to that I I really just can't wait to that I I really just can't wait to share with you. share with you. share with you. » All right, let's go. Buckle up, guys. » All right, let's go. Buckle up, guys. » All right, let's go. Buckle up, guys. » Yeah, buckle up for this, » Yeah, buckle up for this, » Yeah, buckle up for this, right? you know, and you know, I don't right? you know, and you know, I don't right? you know, and you know, I don't want to disparrage anyone else in the want to disparrage anyone else in the want to disparrage anyone else in the world, right? Um, and certainly not my world, right? Um, and certainly not my world, right? Um, and certainly not my competition or anything like that. competition or anything like that. competition or anything like that. That's not my that's not my job is to, That's not my that's not my job is to, That's not my that's not my job is to, you know, badmouth anyone. Um, you know, you know, badmouth anyone. Um, you know, you know, badmouth anyone. Um, you know, cuz there are actually a lot of good IT cuz there are actually a lot of good IT cuz there are actually a lot of good IT firms out there. firms out there. firms out there. » The what I see as being the issue though » The what I see as being the issue though » The what I see as being the issue though is that most IT companies come in is that most IT companies come in is that most IT companies come in [clears throat] [clears throat] [clears throat] and I I think they're they're kind of and I I think they're they're kind of and I I think they're they're kind of like diesel mechanics, right? So, like diesel mechanics, right? So, like diesel mechanics, right? So, they're really good at working on they're really good at working on they're really good at working on engines, engines, engines, » and they'll come in and they'll show you » and they'll come in and they'll show you » and they'll come in and they'll show you their toolbox. Look at my Snap-on tools, their toolbox. Look at my Snap-on tools, their toolbox. Look at my Snap-on tools, and look at my air compressor, and look and look at my air compressor, and look and look at my air compressor, and look at all these wonderful tools that I at all these wonderful tools that I at all these wonderful tools that I have, and they're all shiny, and they're have, and they're all shiny, and they're have, and they're all shiny, and they're all going to allow us to calibrate your all going to allow us to calibrate your all going to allow us to calibrate your engine and get the best possible miles engine and get the best possible miles engine and get the best possible miles per gallon, right? Yep. per gallon, right? Yep. per gallon, right? Yep. » And that's a great thing. There's » And that's a great thing. There's » And that's a great thing. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. But absolutely nothing wrong with that. But absolutely nothing wrong with that. But let's say that you're a shipping let's say that you're a shipping let's say that you're a shipping company, right? You're a trucking company, right? You're a trucking company, right? You're a trucking company. So you have thousands of trucks company. So you have thousands of trucks company. So you have thousands of trucks in your fleet. Does gas mileage matter in your fleet. Does gas mileage matter in your fleet. Does gas mileage matter to you? [snorts] Absolutely. Right? It to you? [snorts] Absolutely. Right? It to you? [snorts] Absolutely. Right? It matters. And you do need well-tuned, matters. And you do need well-tuned, matters. And you do need well-tuned, fine performing engines in those trucks fine performing engines in those trucks fine performing engines in those trucks and you need good gas mileage. But the and you need good gas mileage. But the and you need good gas mileage. But the problem is that's not where you make problem is that's not where you make problem is that's not where you make your money, right? You know, as a your money, right? You know, as a your money, right? You know, as a trucking company, you are a logistics trucking company, you are a logistics trucking company, you are a logistics company who is managing the timely and company who is managing the timely and company who is managing the timely and accurate movement of goods from one accurate movement of goods from one accurate movement of goods from one place to another. And then usually place to another. And then usually place to another. And then usually you're trying to make sure that you move you're trying to make sure that you move you're trying to make sure that you move it in such a way that you don't have, it in such a way that you don't have, it in such a way that you don't have, you know, like a dead head run where you know, like a dead head run where you know, like a dead head run where you have nothing on the truck when it have nothing on the truck when it have nothing on the truck when it returns back to its point of returns back to its point of returns back to its point of origination. Right. origination. Right. origination. Right. » Gotcha. » Gotcha. » Gotcha. » All of those things matter so much more » All of those things matter so much more » All of those things matter so much more than the gas mileage. than the gas mileage. than the gas mileage. » Yeah. So where I think the IT company » Yeah. So where I think the IT company » Yeah. So where I think the IT company needs to come in is is say look I needs to come in is is say look I needs to come in is is say look I understand that you're a shipping understand that you're a shipping understand that you're a shipping company right and I want to understand company right and I want to understand company right and I want to understand more about where your particular more about where your particular more about where your particular bottlenecks are right where your bottlenecks are right where your bottlenecks are right where your business could be more profitable by business could be more profitable by business could be more profitable by using it as a tool it was meant to be using it as a tool it was meant to be using it as a tool it was meant to be right to help you manage those logistics right to help you manage those logistics right to help you manage those logistics and [clears throat] not just to get the and [clears throat] not just to get the and [clears throat] not just to get the best gas mileage on your truck. So the best gas mileage on your truck. So the best gas mileage on your truck. So the degree of separation I think some people degree of separation I think some people degree of separation I think some people have with it is uh it of uh here's keep have with it is uh it of uh here's keep have with it is uh it of uh here's keep things safe, keep them working and then things safe, keep them working and then things safe, keep them working and then you're talking on top of that of saying you're talking on top of that of saying you're talking on top of that of saying I think also it should encompass uh I think also it should encompass uh I think also it should encompass uh logistics around your technology and logistics around your technology and logistics around your technology and software because that almost sounds like software because that almost sounds like software because that almost sounds like uh what I'm trying to I'm drawing a uh what I'm trying to I'm drawing a uh what I'm trying to I'm drawing a blank on the word I want to say like blank on the word I want to say like blank on the word I want to say like data management or processing data management or processing data management or processing data accurately to make more informed accurately to make more informed accurately to make more informed decisions. Um, but what is that decisions. Um, but what is that decisions. Um, but what is that piece of you guys that actually does piece of you guys that actually does piece of you guys that actually does that part? Cuz that almost sounds like that part? Cuz that almost sounds like that part? Cuz that almost sounds like outside of it to me even in that outside of it to me even in that outside of it to me even in that analogy. Uh, which is great. It's like analogy. Uh, which is great. It's like analogy. Uh, which is great. It's like understanding that part. Where do you understanding that part. Where do you understanding that part. Where do you put like a trucking company? Go back to put like a trucking company? Go back to put like a trucking company? Go back to the analogy. They are come back and they the analogy. They are come back and they the analogy. They are come back and they did not properly route that truck for did not properly route that truck for did not properly route that truck for max profitability. Like where do max profitability. Like where do max profitability. Like where do you guys come into place in that? So you guys come into place in that? So you guys come into place in that? So there are there are many jumping off there are there are many jumping off there are there are many jumping off points from that, but I guess if you points from that, but I guess if you points from that, but I guess if you wanted to start at the very beginning of wanted to start at the very beginning of wanted to start at the very beginning of the food chain, it would be one to help the food chain, it would be one to help the food chain, it would be one to help them identify the fact that they need them identify the fact that they need them identify the fact that they need some kind of a scheduling software or some kind of a scheduling software or some kind of a scheduling software or they need a module that fits in uh to they need a module that fits in uh to they need a module that fits in uh to their existing their existing their existing » software system. We call it their line » software system. We call it their line » software system. We call it their line of business application, right? Their of business application, right? Their of business application, right? Their their chief software that they use. So their chief software that they use. So their chief software that they use. So um first thing we would do is we try to um first thing we would do is we try to um first thing we would do is we try to help them identify one, we need this help them identify one, we need this help them identify one, we need this two, what are the needs? What are the two, what are the needs? What are the two, what are the needs? What are the specific features of this software that specific features of this software that specific features of this software that we need for it to perform? we need for it to perform? we need for it to perform? » Okay. » Okay. » Okay. » And then there's selection and » And then there's selection and » And then there's selection and evaluation and demo testing. And then evaluation and demo testing. And then evaluation and demo testing. And then there's implementation. there's implementation. there's implementation. » Yeah. Which is the that's the » Yeah. Which is the that's the » Yeah. Which is the that's the implementation is the hardest part. implementation is the hardest part. implementation is the hardest part. » And then long-term maintenance. » And then long-term maintenance. » And then long-term maintenance. » Long-term maintenance. So, so again, I I » Long-term maintenance. So, so again, I I » Long-term maintenance. So, so again, I I think our think our think our » setting up one password and then » setting up one password and then » setting up one password and then continuing to use it, not just, you continuing to use it, not just, you continuing to use it, not just, you know, you get halfway through your know, you get halfway through your know, you get halfway through your passwords and you're like, I'll come passwords and you're like, I'll come passwords and you're like, I'll come back to the other half next year, back to the other half next year, back to the other half next year, » right? And I I really think the » right? And I I really think the » right? And I I really think the important part to understand is that it important part to understand is that it important part to understand is that it is a tool. is a tool. is a tool. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » And so, you know, if you look at it, um, » And so, you know, if you look at it, um, » And so, you know, if you look at it, um, you know, over history, right? I guess you know, over history, right? I guess you know, over history, right? I guess at some point in time, people were using at some point in time, people were using at some point in time, people were using rocks as hammers, right? And they were, rocks as hammers, right? And they were, rocks as hammers, right? And they were, you know, maybe they started with their you know, maybe they started with their you know, maybe they started with their fists and they decided that was fists and they decided that was fists and they decided that was kind of painful. And then they went to kind of painful. And then they went to kind of painful. And then they went to rocks and then, you know, hey, we rocks and then, you know, hey, we rocks and then, you know, hey, we figured out how to make steel hammers, figured out how to make steel hammers, figured out how to make steel hammers, right? Hammerheads, right? And we start right? Hammerheads, right? And we start right? Hammerheads, right? And we start using hammers. And then we went to using hammers. And then we went to using hammers. And then we went to pneumatic nailers, right? And today we pneumatic nailers, right? And today we pneumatic nailers, right? And today we have, you know, batterypowered nailers, have, you know, batterypowered nailers, have, you know, batterypowered nailers, right? right? right? » Um, the operation, the function, and » Um, the operation, the function, and » Um, the operation, the function, and everything is still the same. The everything is still the same. The everything is still the same. The difference is is how more productive is difference is is how more productive is difference is is how more productive is my carpenter because he's using right a my carpenter because he's using right a my carpenter because he's using right a gun that has a um you know battery gun that has a um you know battery gun that has a um you know battery powered and I don't have to drag cords powered and I don't have to drag cords powered and I don't have to drag cords around. I don't need electricity for the around. I don't need electricity for the around. I don't need electricity for the air compressor to provide air power and air compressor to provide air power and air compressor to provide air power and that kind of thing. How much more that kind of thing. How much more that kind of thing. How much more productive and efficient productive and efficient productive and efficient » is that carpenter by using that » is that carpenter by using that » is that carpenter by using that particular gun? Right. Yeah. It needs to particular gun? Right. Yeah. It needs to particular gun? Right. Yeah. It needs to be approached from the same way. It's be approached from the same way. It's be approached from the same way. It's not it shouldn't be like, hey, I'm not it shouldn't be like, hey, I'm not it shouldn't be like, hey, I'm buying an antivirus because I just want buying an antivirus because I just want buying an antivirus because I just want to keep an antivirus or keep a virus off to keep an antivirus or keep a virus off to keep an antivirus or keep a virus off of my system. It should be what is my of my system. It should be what is my of my system. It should be what is my coordinated effort of the different coordinated effort of the different coordinated effort of the different softwares and tools that I use that softwares and tools that I use that softwares and tools that I use that allow my employees to be the most allow my employees to be the most allow my employees to be the most productive, the most efficient, and the productive, the most efficient, and the productive, the most efficient, and the most profitable. most profitable. most profitable. » Yeah. And the only way to actually do » Yeah. And the only way to actually do » Yeah. And the only way to actually do that is to understand the business, that is to understand the business, that is to understand the business, understand the processes and procedures understand the processes and procedures understand the processes and procedures that the business goes through so that the business goes through so that the business goes through so that you can buy the right tools to do that you can buy the right tools to do that you can buy the right tools to do that job. And there's a fancy term for that job. And there's a fancy term for that job. And there's a fancy term for that called the lowest total cost of called the lowest total cost of called the lowest total cost of ownership, ownership, ownership, » right? And you can achieve the lowest » right? And you can achieve the lowest » right? And you can achieve the lowest total cost of ownership in a lot of total cost of ownership in a lot of total cost of ownership in a lot of different ways. Uh but most importantly different ways. Uh but most importantly different ways. Uh but most importantly above those is not to spend money on above those is not to spend money on above those is not to spend money on things that you don't need things that you don't need things that you don't need » or worse buy the wrong thing and then » or worse buy the wrong thing and then » or worse buy the wrong thing and then figure out it's actually the wrong thing figure out it's actually the wrong thing figure out it's actually the wrong thing and then spend money on the right thing. and then spend money on the right thing. and then spend money on the right thing. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » You know [snorts] those are » You know [snorts] those are » You know [snorts] those are » well speaking of uh it's a great segue » well speaking of uh it's a great segue » well speaking of uh it's a great segue into uh evolution of tools. Let's go into uh evolution of tools. Let's go into uh evolution of tools. Let's go into AI. So from a hand to a pneumatic into AI. So from a hand to a pneumatic into AI. So from a hand to a pneumatic nailer or I guess electricity right nailer or I guess electricity right nailer or I guess electricity right » now [clears throat] here's AI » now [clears throat] here's AI » now [clears throat] here's AI » and which in LA and you've been » and which in LA and you've been » and which in LA and you've been talking about it a lot in our group talking about it a lot in our group talking about it a lot in our group sessions. Um uh what does that look like sessions. Um uh what does that look like sessions. Um uh what does that look like today? Uh is there increased today? Uh is there increased today? Uh is there increased vulnerabilities because of it? Like do vulnerabilities because of it? Like do vulnerabilities because of it? Like do you see things getting more difficult in you see things getting more difficult in you see things getting more difficult in your industry or like and by the way your industry or like and by the way your industry or like and by the way drink your coffee and I have that. Yeah. drink your coffee and I have that. Yeah. drink your coffee and I have that. Yeah. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, » I just feel like I I don't want it to » I just feel like I I don't want it to » I just feel like I I don't want it to get cold. That stresses me out. get cold. That stresses me out. get cold. That stresses me out. » Oh, no. Yeah, » Oh, no. Yeah, » Oh, no. Yeah, » you're stressing me out, JD. Your coffee » you're stressing me out, JD. Your coffee » you're stressing me out, JD. Your coffee is getting cold. is getting cold. is getting cold. » You know what I think you're doing is » You know what I think you're doing is » You know what I think you're doing is deflecting, right? Because I deflecting, right? Because I deflecting, right? Because I think all these questions on how you're think all these questions on how you're think all these questions on how you're managing technology in your own company managing technology in your own company managing technology in your own company are uncomfortable vulnerable are uncomfortable vulnerable are uncomfortable vulnerable » and so you're trying to like pass that » and so you're trying to like pass that » and so you're trying to like pass that off onto a different topic, right? off onto a different topic, right? off onto a different topic, right? » Oh, you still have a lot to learn about » Oh, you still have a lot to learn about » Oh, you still have a lot to learn about me. Everyone else knows I'm an idiot and me. Everyone else knows I'm an idiot and me. Everyone else knows I'm an idiot and knows I'm an idiot. knows I'm an idiot. knows I'm an idiot. No, that's funny. No, that's funny. No, that's funny. » Uh, but yeah, like the AI I just that's » Uh, but yeah, like the AI I just that's » Uh, but yeah, like the AI I just that's like what I've been dying to talk about. like what I've been dying to talk about. like what I've been dying to talk about. » Okay. » Okay. » Okay. » Uh, because gosh, I mean, I'm sure » Uh, because gosh, I mean, I'm sure » Uh, because gosh, I mean, I'm sure you're still like I know this much, you're still like I know this much, you're still like I know this much, but we still don't know a lot. but we still don't know a lot. but we still don't know a lot. Absolutely. And that's we're in the same Absolutely. And that's we're in the same Absolutely. And that's we're in the same position at Killer Growth. Like we know position at Killer Growth. Like we know position at Killer Growth. Like we know way more than we did and we do feel like way more than we did and we do feel like way more than we did and we do feel like we're on the cutting edge of it every we're on the cutting edge of it every we're on the cutting edge of it every day, but it's still like so much we day, but it's still like so much we day, but it's still like so much we don't know. It it just still feels like don't know. It it just still feels like don't know. It it just still feels like this black box of like what is this black box of like what is this black box of like what is this going to look like for our clients in 6 going to look like for our clients in 6 going to look like for our clients in 6 months, right? Or for your clients in a months, right? Or for your clients in a months, right? Or for your clients in a year is probably in your head all the year is probably in your head all the year is probably in your head all the time. Like what does this look like? time. Like what does this look like? time. Like what does this look like? » And I I think you know you go back to » And I I think you know you go back to » And I I think you know you go back to that evolutionary thing, you know, and that evolutionary thing, you know, and that evolutionary thing, you know, and you think about from you I guess the you think about from you I guess the you think about from you I guess the time whichever version you time whichever version you time whichever version you want, right? The either we were created want, right? The either we were created want, right? The either we were created now we're on to religion. now we're on to religion. now we're on to religion. » Oh, there it is. » Oh, there it is. » Oh, there it is. » We were either created or we crawled out » We were either created or we crawled out » We were either created or we crawled out of the trees, right? Whatever of the trees, right? Whatever of the trees, right? Whatever it was, right? we started walking up, it was, right? we started walking up, it was, right? we started walking up, right? right? right? » Um, but you know, from that period of » Um, but you know, from that period of » Um, but you know, from that period of time to the invention of the wheel, time to the invention of the wheel, time to the invention of the wheel, » right, was not measured in in hours » right, was not measured in in hours » right, was not measured in in hours or weeks or days, right? It was probably or weeks or days, right? It was probably or weeks or days, right? It was probably hundreds or thousands of years, right? hundreds or thousands of years, right? hundreds or thousands of years, right? If not If not If not » more, right? Of course, you know, again, » more, right? Of course, you know, again, » more, right? Of course, you know, again, we're back to the religion. 5,000 years we're back to the religion. 5,000 years we're back to the religion. 5,000 years is kind of the cut off for some, right? is kind of the cut off for some, right? is kind of the cut off for some, right? And so, And so, And so, » you know, but anyway, it it took a » you know, but anyway, it it took a » you know, but anyway, it it took a period of time to to create that wheel, period of time to to create that wheel, period of time to to create that wheel, right? and then other tools and other right? and then other tools and other right? and then other tools and other things that come along. So we go from things that come along. So we go from things that come along. So we go from bronze age to Iron Age and all of these bronze age to Iron Age and all of these bronze age to Iron Age and all of these things, right? things, right? things, right? » Um » Um » Um » so the major changes that AI is » so the major changes that AI is » so the major changes that AI is bringing is is very comparable to the bringing is is very comparable to the bringing is is very comparable to the major changes that the internet brought. major changes that the internet brought. major changes that the internet brought. The difference is the internet took a The difference is the internet took a The difference is the internet took a couple of decades to bring and AI is couple of decades to bring and AI is couple of decades to bring and AI is coming like coming like coming like » I mean like a year and a half ago people » I mean like a year and a half ago people » I mean like a year and a half ago people started like using it like started like using it like started like using it like » the common like the you know just the » the common like the you know just the » the common like the you know just the everyday person it's not been more than everyday person it's not been more than everyday person it's not been more than a year and a half right a year and a half right a year and a half right » that they've integrated it into their » that they've integrated it into their » that they've integrated it into their lives like which is nuts lives like which is nuts lives like which is nuts » and so I think the biggest problem with » and so I think the biggest problem with » and so I think the biggest problem with AI right now is just figuring out how to AI right now is just figuring out how to AI right now is just figuring out how to use it where to use it when to use it use it where to use it when to use it use it where to use it when to use it why to use it and like you said we some why to use it and like you said we some why to use it and like you said we some knowledge of that. We have some knowledge of that. We have some knowledge of that. We have some experience using that. We see some ideas experience using that. We see some ideas experience using that. We see some ideas where it works really well. where it works really well. where it works really well. » But even the newspapers are » But even the newspapers are » But even the newspapers are [clears throat] well, they're not really [clears throat] well, they're not really [clears throat] well, they're not really newspapers anymore. Sorry, I'm old newspapers anymore. Sorry, I'm old newspapers anymore. Sorry, I'm old school. But um but if you read Apple school. But um but if you read Apple school. But um but if you read Apple News or or any of the online News or or any of the online News or or any of the online » careful, don't offend roller climber up » careful, don't offend roller climber up » careful, don't offend roller climber up there, right? He built this building and there, right? He built this building and there, right? He built this building and it was a newspaper. it was a newspaper. it was a newspaper. » The news is still the same. It's just » The news is still the same. It's just » The news is still the same. It's just that they presented on has changed, that they presented on has changed, that they presented on has changed, right? But the um you know you big right? But the um you know you big right? But the um you know you big companies right are struggling with companies right are struggling with companies right are struggling with this. How do we get a return on this. How do we get a return on this. How do we get a return on investment because at the end of the day investment because at the end of the day investment because at the end of the day AI is just a tool right? It is just a AI is just a tool right? It is just a AI is just a tool right? It is just a battery operated nailer and we just need battery operated nailer and we just need battery operated nailer and we just need to figure out how to use that nailer to to figure out how to use that nailer to to figure out how to use that nailer to help our employees be more productive, help our employees be more productive, help our employees be more productive, more efficient, more profitable. Yeah. more efficient, more profitable. Yeah. more efficient, more profitable. Yeah. At the end of the day, that's At the end of the day, that's At the end of the day, that's » and that's the gap that's like I » and that's the gap that's like I » and that's the gap that's like I appreciate that line of thinking because appreciate that line of thinking because appreciate that line of thinking because I think when you go think it's a tool, I think when you go think it's a tool, I think when you go think it's a tool, there's less fear. there's less fear. there's less fear. » If you think it's now the person running » If you think it's now the person running » If you think it's now the person running the nailer, the nailer, the nailer, » that to me is like the contentious » that to me is like the contentious » that to me is like the contentious like the fear everywhere is that it's like the fear everywhere is that it's like the fear everywhere is that it's actually not at all that it's now it's actually not at all that it's now it's actually not at all that it's now it's the human and the nailer. the human and the nailer. the human and the nailer. » You know what I mean? It's like now it's » You know what I mean? It's like now it's » You know what I mean? It's like now it's like taking over these different like taking over these different like taking over these different positions which I mean rightfully so positions which I mean rightfully so positions which I mean rightfully so there is certain things that it is there is certain things that it is there is certain things that it is replacing that was done manually right replacing that was done manually right replacing that was done manually right like that a human operated um and like that a human operated um and like that a human operated um and there's humans training it to take their there's humans training it to take their there's humans training it to take their jobs uh but extracting information jobs uh but extracting information jobs uh but extracting information delivering information like really not delivering information like really not delivering information like really nothing crazy complicated um at this nothing crazy complicated um at this nothing crazy complicated um at this point it does speed up production so point it does speed up production so point it does speed up production so like from the user perspective like when like from the user perspective like when like from the user perspective like when a human's using It's 100% the electric a human's using It's 100% the electric a human's using It's 100% the electric nailer, nailer, nailer, » right? » right? » right? » I feel like society as a whole is, you » I feel like society as a whole is, you » I feel like society as a whole is, you know, struggling and wrestling with the know, struggling and wrestling with the know, struggling and wrestling with the fact that it's fact that it's fact that it's » maybe not the [clears throat] nailer and » maybe not the [clears throat] nailer and » maybe not the [clears throat] nailer and it's the human. it's the human. it's the human. » Well, you know, you asked me earlier » Well, you know, you asked me earlier » Well, you know, you asked me earlier about how some of my customers have about how some of my customers have about how some of my customers have changed over time and some of that. So, changed over time and some of that. So, changed over time and some of that. So, kind of relevant to that, a real world kind of relevant to that, a real world kind of relevant to that, a real world example of of one thing that happened example of of one thing that happened example of of one thing that happened and this actually happened 10 or 15 and this actually happened 10 or 15 and this actually happened 10 or 15 years ago, but I had a client come in years ago, but I had a client come in years ago, but I had a client come in and um not that they were unhappy with and um not that they were unhappy with and um not that they were unhappy with the service, they just don't like the service, they just don't like the service, they just don't like the bill, right? like, "Wow, we're paying a bill, right? like, "Wow, we're paying a bill, right? like, "Wow, we're paying a lot of money for it support." And we lot of money for it support." And we lot of money for it support." And we thought computers were supposed to make thought computers were supposed to make thought computers were supposed to make everything cheaper and easier and everything cheaper and easier and everything cheaper and easier and friendlier and I said, "Well, you friendlier and I said, "Well, you friendlier and I said, "Well, you know, that's that's a really big know, that's that's a really big know, that's that's a really big misconception." What basically happened misconception." What basically happened misconception." What basically happened was someone came in and said, you know, was someone came in and said, you know, was someone came in and said, you know, today, you know, in a in a multi-million today, you know, in a in a multi-million today, you know, in a in a multi-million dollar company, you've got five or 10 dollar company, you've got five or 10 dollar company, you've got five or 10 accountants and they've all got very accountants and they've all got very accountants and they've all got very sharp pencils and a lot of pencil sharp pencils and a lot of pencil sharp pencils and a lot of pencil sharpeners and they've got a an actual sharpeners and they've got a an actual sharpeners and they've got a an actual paper ledger in a bound book. Right. And paper ledger in a bound book. Right. And paper ledger in a bound book. Right. And they're performing all these they're performing all these they're performing all these calculations, I don't know, on an abacus calculations, I don't know, on an abacus calculations, I don't know, on an abacus or something. Right. Sam, do you know or something. Right. Sam, do you know or something. Right. Sam, do you know what an abacus is? what an abacus is? what an abacus is? » I do. I do. Yeah. I can't pronounce it, » I do. I do. Yeah. I can't pronounce it, » I do. I do. Yeah. I can't pronounce it, but I know what you're talking about. but I know what you're talking about. but I know what you're talking about. » And so they, you know, and » And so they, you know, and » And so they, you know, and the promise of it was not that you would the promise of it was not that you would the promise of it was not that you would spend less money. The the promise of it spend less money. The the promise of it spend less money. The the promise of it was that if you needed 10 accountants was that if you needed 10 accountants was that if you needed 10 accountants before, maybe you only need one or maybe before, maybe you only need one or maybe before, maybe you only need one or maybe you need two. you need two. you need two. » Right. And then kind of what happened is » Right. And then kind of what happened is » Right. And then kind of what happened is is you just took the money you were is you just took the money you were is you just took the money you were spending on those extra accountants, spending on those extra accountants, spending on those extra accountants, right? And now you're paying for right? And now you're paying for right? And now you're paying for technology. But at the end of the day, technology. But at the end of the day, technology. But at the end of the day, right, it should enable the growth of right, it should enable the growth of right, it should enable the growth of your company, right? That you can be your company, right? That you can be your company, right? That you can be more productive, more efficient, and more productive, more efficient, and more productive, more efficient, and more profitable. more profitable. more profitable. » And so that's that's how it needs to » And so that's that's how it needs to » And so that's that's how it needs to change. And that's what people really, I change. And that's what people really, I change. And that's what people really, I think, should be focusing on. think, should be focusing on. think, should be focusing on. » Yeah. Yeah. How to use it and that it's » Yeah. Yeah. How to use it and that it's » Yeah. Yeah. How to use it and that it's not a threat, it's an opportunity. Well not a threat, it's an opportunity. Well not a threat, it's an opportunity. Well um so you know the concept I think um so you know the concept I think um so you know the concept I think we're talking about here is called we're talking about here is called we're talking about here is called disruptive technology disruptive technology disruptive technology » right when one technology replaces » right when one technology replaces » right when one technology replaces another and so you think about you know another and so you think about you know another and so you think about you know again talking about evolution in the again talking about evolution in the again talking about evolution in the world so you know a long time ago right world so you know a long time ago right world so you know a long time ago right navies right ships we say ships were navies right ships we say ships were navies right ships we say ships were made of wood and men were made of steel made of wood and men were made of steel made of wood and men were made of steel right and during this period and during right and during this period and during right and during this period and during this period of time right we had real this period of time right we had real this period of time right we had real sailing vessels and so you know you sailing vessels and so you know you sailing vessels and so you know you string up sails and you capture the wind string up sails and you capture the wind string up sails and you capture the wind and you tack against the wind. It's very and you tack against the wind. It's very and you tack against the wind. It's very ineffective, ineffective, ineffective, » you know, because you have to one wait » you know, because you have to one wait » you know, because you have to one wait for the wind and if the wind's not for the wind and if the wind's not for the wind and if the wind's not blowing, you have no propulsion. And blowing, you have no propulsion. And blowing, you have no propulsion. And then two, you have to kind of go in then two, you have to kind of go in then two, you have to kind of go in angles and you have to tack against that angles and you have to tack against that angles and you have to tack against that wind and it's never a straight line from wind and it's never a straight line from wind and it's never a straight line from point A to point B point A to point B point A to point B » unless you're [snorts] just really lucky » unless you're [snorts] just really lucky » unless you're [snorts] just really lucky and the wind's blowing and the wind's blowing and the wind's blowing » exactly » exactly » exactly » due east and you want to go due east, » due east and you want to go due east, » due east and you want to go due east, right? So, but now you invent the right? So, but now you invent the right? So, but now you invent the steamship and it is very threatening for the sail and it is very threatening for the sail and it is very threatening for the sail makers and it's very threatening for the makers and it's very threatening for the makers and it's very threatening for the sailors that knew how to hoist sales sailors that knew how to hoist sales sailors that knew how to hoist sales because those jobs are no longer needed. because those jobs are no longer needed. because those jobs are no longer needed. But it also created the need for people But it also created the need for people But it also created the need for people who could run steam engines and who were who could run steam engines and who were who could run steam engines and who were mechanics and who could keep those mechanics and who could keep those mechanics and who could keep those engines running. So, engines running. So, engines running. So, » um, » um, » um, » so the question is what is that for AI? » so the question is what is that for AI? » so the question is what is that for AI? Give me your best Give me your best Give me your best » and that's it. Well, » and that's it. Well, » and that's it. Well, » give me a hypothetical. Well, I think » give me a hypothetical. Well, I think » give me a hypothetical. Well, I think that what's going to happen is is that what's going to happen is is that what's going to happen is is that um I I'm not convinced AI is going to um I I'm not convinced AI is going to um I I'm not convinced AI is going to take your job. Um I think it's a little take your job. Um I think it's a little take your job. Um I think it's a little more complicated than that, right? I more complicated than that, right? I more complicated than that, right? I just think human beings and human minds just think human beings and human minds just think human beings and human minds and the way humans think I I don't know and the way humans think I I don't know and the way humans think I I don't know that all the scientific or all the that all the scientific or all the that all the scientific or all the science fiction stuff about, you know, science fiction stuff about, you know, science fiction stuff about, you know, thinking computers is really going to thinking computers is really going to thinking computers is really going to happen or not. I guess we'll wait and happen or not. I guess we'll wait and happen or not. I guess we'll wait and see. see. see. » But at the end of the day, I don't think » But at the end of the day, I don't think » But at the end of the day, I don't think AI in the next 10 years is going to take AI in the next 10 years is going to take AI in the next 10 years is going to take your job. But I think someone who knows your job. But I think someone who knows your job. But I think someone who knows how to use AI to do your job is likely how to use AI to do your job is likely how to use AI to do your job is likely to take your job to take your job to take your job » and could probably take multiple » and could probably take multiple » and could probably take multiple people's jobs. people's jobs. people's jobs. » Yes. » Yes. » Yes. » And I think if you're a fleet of 10 » And I think if you're a fleet of 10 » And I think if you're a fleet of 10 accountants, right, we we may not need accountants, right, we we may not need accountants, right, we we may not need that many accountants anymore because that many accountants anymore because that many accountants anymore because now we have computers to do the job, now we have computers to do the job, now we have computers to do the job, right? So AI is the same thing, right? right? So AI is the same thing, right? right? So AI is the same thing, right? We may not need We may not need We may not need » as many marketing firms, Sam. » as many marketing firms, Sam. » as many marketing firms, Sam. » I know. » I know. » I know. » Right. Because AI is pretty good at » Right. Because AI is pretty good at » Right. Because AI is pretty good at doing what you guys do, right? So yeah, doing what you guys do, right? So yeah, doing what you guys do, right? So yeah, it does a lot of what we do for us, it does a lot of what we do for us, it does a lot of what we do for us, » right? » right? » right? » So I think we're just going to have to » So I think we're just going to have to » So I think we're just going to have to focus more on on human thought and how focus more on on human thought and how focus more on on human thought and how we solve problems using those tools. we solve problems using those tools. we solve problems using those tools. » And that's the I think that's the answer » And that's the I think that's the answer » And that's the I think that's the answer is that you have to get behind it and is that you have to get behind it and is that you have to get behind it and decide what problem does it solve, decide what problem does it solve, decide what problem does it solve, right? And so like for us specifically right? And so like for us specifically right? And so like for us specifically internally, we found multiple service internally, we found multiple service internally, we found multiple service lines that we offer that we're able to lines that we offer that we're able to lines that we offer that we're able to deploy AI and offer a higher output with deploy AI and offer a higher output with deploy AI and offer a higher output with no increase in cost to our clients, no increase in cost to our clients, no increase in cost to our clients, right? We're able to offer more value to right? We're able to offer more value to right? We're able to offer more value to clients without actually raising our clients without actually raising our clients without actually raising our price. And it's not a we're not doing a price. And it's not a we're not doing a price. And it's not a we're not doing a race to the bottom. We're just saying, race to the bottom. We're just saying, race to the bottom. We're just saying, okay, how are we going to leverage this okay, how are we going to leverage this okay, how are we going to leverage this tool? This is who we are. Everybody's tool? This is who we are. Everybody's tool? This is who we are. Everybody's happy. And then could we do more? Right? happy. And then could we do more? Right? happy. And then could we do more? Right? could be. could be. could be. » So, you just sang my song, right, Sam? » So, you just sang my song, right, Sam? » So, you just sang my song, right, Sam? Because what you said was, "My employees Because what you said was, "My employees Because what you said was, "My employees are now more productive, more are now more productive, more are now more productive, more efficient." efficient." efficient." » Well, we had that profitable » Well, we had that profitable » Well, we had that profitable » 100%. Um, we had that moment where we » 100%. Um, we had that moment where we » 100%. Um, we had that moment where we had something uh come through and we had something uh come through and we had something uh come through and we were like, "Oh, this kind of does two of were like, "Oh, this kind of does two of were like, "Oh, this kind of does two of our people's job." So, like we we it was our people's job." So, like we we it was our people's job." So, like we we it was like the first time we felt that earlier like the first time we felt that earlier like the first time we felt that earlier in the year. It's like, "So, do are they in the year. It's like, "So, do are they in the year. It's like, "So, do are they still here or still here or still here or » or do we go?" And the uh answer for all » or do we go?" And the uh answer for all » or do we go?" And the uh answer for all of us was like no, they should stay. of us was like no, they should stay. of us was like no, they should stay. They're awesome. Like let's put this in They're awesome. Like let's put this in They're awesome. Like let's put this in their hands and see how much more we their hands and see how much more we their hands and see how much more we could do, right? And uh so yeah, I would could do, right? And uh so yeah, I would could do, right? And uh so yeah, I would agree. I would say our team will agree. I would say our team will agree. I would say our team will probably grow slower, but it'll grow probably grow slower, but it'll grow probably grow slower, but it'll grow more strategic around how we do what we more strategic around how we do what we more strategic around how we do what we do, right? Like it needs to be someone do, right? Like it needs to be someone do, right? Like it needs to be someone that can jump in and understand how we that can jump in and understand how we that can jump in and understand how we utilize AI to provide uh exceptional utilize AI to provide uh exceptional utilize AI to provide uh exceptional service to our clients. service to our clients. service to our clients. » Exactly. Um, and so it'll just look » Exactly. Um, and so it'll just look » Exactly. Um, and so it'll just look different, you know, and they have to be different, you know, and they have to be different, you know, and they have to be willing to adapt. Like you said, the willing to adapt. Like you said, the willing to adapt. Like you said, the person who knows how to harness it person who knows how to harness it person who knows how to harness it versus the 10 that don't, they might be versus the 10 that don't, they might be versus the 10 that don't, they might be gone. And a buddy of mine who writes uh gone. And a buddy of mine who writes uh gone. And a buddy of mine who writes uh code, this percentage was wild to code, this percentage was wild to code, this percentage was wild to me. He uh has been using uh [snorts] me. He uh has been using uh [snorts] me. He uh has been using uh [snorts] Cloudbot, so he's doing development. He Cloudbot, so he's doing development. He Cloudbot, so he's doing development. He has three different computers and he's has three different computers and he's has three different computers and he's contracted. He's on a he represents a contracted. He's on a he represents a contracted. He's on a he represents a team. There's 10 people full-time team. There's 10 people full-time team. There's 10 people full-time working on the same project. 10 working on the same project. 10 working on the same project. 10 different software engineers different software engineers different software engineers and the report came back in a quarter and the report came back in a quarter and the report came back in a quarter and he had done 60some percent of the and he had done 60some percent of the and he had done 60some percent of the code of the team of 10. One guy code of the team of 10. One guy code of the team of 10. One guy » and like that's the example of like he's » and like that's the example of like he's » and like that's the example of like he's he's definitely ahead of his time and he's definitely ahead of his time and he's definitely ahead of his time and how he's figured out how to do it. how he's figured out how to do it. how he's figured out how to do it. » Sure. Um but he's plowing through all » Sure. Um but he's plowing through all » Sure. Um but he's plowing through all this. And so that's a moment where every this. And so that's a moment where every this. And so that's a moment where every business owner even in that world uh business owner even in that world uh business owner even in that world uh right in, uh software development, right in, uh software development, right in, uh software development, they're look probably looking at it they're look probably looking at it they're look probably looking at it going, "Okay, this is, you know, there's going, "Okay, this is, you know, there's going, "Okay, this is, you know, there's still slop, still clean up, you know, still slop, still clean up, you know, still slop, still clean up, you know, still stuff that's going to break." still stuff that's going to break." still stuff that's going to break." » Um but at that rate of increase, if they » Um but at that rate of increase, if they » Um but at that rate of increase, if they had two of him and not the other eight, had two of him and not the other eight, had two of him and not the other eight, they would have done 120% of they would have done 120% of they would have done 120% of » right the project. Um, so yeah, you're » right the project. Um, so yeah, you're » right the project. Um, so yeah, you're right on like that's I I agree. I think right on like that's I I agree. I think right on like that's I I agree. I think that's where that's where that's where » So again, yeah, I think that's where AI » So again, yeah, I think that's where AI » So again, yeah, I think that's where AI is a tool. is a tool. is a tool. » Yep. » Yep. » Yep. » Right. And if you're I think there's » Right. And if you're I think there's » Right. And if you're I think there's there's some ethics and work ethic that there's some ethics and work ethic that there's some ethics and work ethic that come into this. Right. So on the on the come into this. Right. So on the on the come into this. Right. So on the on the ownership side, the ethics are, ownership side, the ethics are, ownership side, the ethics are, » you know, can we train people? Can we » you know, can we train people? Can we » you know, can we train people? Can we invest in our people and teach them how invest in our people and teach them how invest in our people and teach them how to use this AI and repurpose them to use this AI and repurpose them to use this AI and repurpose them to other tasks, right, to make the to other tasks, right, to make the to other tasks, right, to make the entire organization more profitable, entire organization more profitable, entire organization more profitable, more effective, right? more effective, right? more effective, right? » Y » Y » Y » um on the employee side, you we're going » um on the employee side, you we're going » um on the employee side, you we're going to have to have some work ethic. We're to have to have some work ethic. We're to have to have some work ethic. We're going to have to be willing to change. going to have to be willing to change. going to have to be willing to change. We're going to have to realize uh that We're going to have to realize uh that We're going to have to realize uh that if we don't invest something in this and if we don't invest something in this and if we don't invest something in this and learn this, then we're going to lose learn this, then we're going to lose learn this, then we're going to lose something. But I also think it's it's an something. But I also think it's it's an something. But I also think it's it's an important uh concept, right? It's a it's important uh concept, right? It's a it's important uh concept, right? It's a it's a good analogy when you talk about that a good analogy when you talk about that a good analogy when you talk about that one guy. one guy. one guy. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Who's writing 60% of the code and so » Who's writing 60% of the code and so » Who's writing 60% of the code and so we're going to drop off eight people and we're going to drop off eight people and we're going to drop off eight people and just keep these two who are, you know, just keep these two who are, you know, just keep these two who are, you know, doing 120%. doing 120%. doing 120%. » The interesting thought process here » The interesting thought process here » The interesting thought process here though is that realistically you cannot though is that realistically you cannot though is that realistically you cannot allow AI [snorts] allow AI [snorts] allow AI [snorts] to become the one who thinks for you. So to become the one who thinks for you. So to become the one who thinks for you. So you can't replace the human. you can't replace the human. you can't replace the human. » Uh-uh. » Uh-uh. » Uh-uh. » Right? Because your most vulnerable » Right? Because your most vulnerable » Right? Because your most vulnerable problem is that at least from a cyber problem is that at least from a cyber problem is that at least from a cyber security standpoint is that if you allow security standpoint is that if you allow security standpoint is that if you allow AI to generate all that code, how do you AI to generate all that code, how do you AI to generate all that code, how do you know that some malicious actor didn't know that some malicious actor didn't know that some malicious actor didn't train that AI? train that AI? train that AI? » Sure. » Sure. » Sure. » And is writing backdoor codes into this, » And is writing backdoor codes into this, » And is writing backdoor codes into this, you know, the code lines that they're you know, the code lines that they're you know, the code lines that they're creating for you and compromising your creating for you and compromising your creating for you and compromising your system. And the only one who can system. And the only one who can system. And the only one who can evaluate that is probably a human being evaluate that is probably a human being evaluate that is probably a human being who knows how to code. So you don't get who knows how to code. So you don't get who knows how to code. So you don't get rid of the programming skills. You just rid of the programming skills. You just rid of the programming skills. You just use different tools. Yeah. use different tools. Yeah. use different tools. Yeah. » Very similar to a carpenter, » Very similar to a carpenter, » Very similar to a carpenter, » right? That electric nail gun, that » right? That electric nail gun, that » right? That electric nail gun, that battery operated nail gun didn't change battery operated nail gun didn't change battery operated nail gun didn't change anything about how a wall is designed, anything about how a wall is designed, anything about how a wall is designed, how you lift it up, how you how you nail how you lift it up, how you how you nail how you lift it up, how you how you nail it in place or any of that. That human it in place or any of that. That human it in place or any of that. That human knowledge needs to be retained. It's knowledge needs to be retained. It's knowledge needs to be retained. It's just the tool that they use. Yeah. Yeah. just the tool that they use. Yeah. Yeah. just the tool that they use. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. Uh la last question on That's good. Uh la last question on That's good. Uh la last question on vulnerabilities. What what new cyber vulnerabilities. What what new cyber vulnerabilities. What what new cyber security issues do you see coming down security issues do you see coming down security issues do you see coming down the pipeline because of AI? the pipeline because of AI? the pipeline because of AI? » Uh there are there are a couple one of » Uh there are there are a couple one of » Uh there are there are a couple one of those is just the sophistication of the those is just the sophistication of the those is just the sophistication of the hacking attacks, the fishing attacks. hacking attacks, the fishing attacks. hacking attacks, the fishing attacks. Um, so there was a time when we we had a Um, so there was a time when we we had a Um, so there was a time when we we had a theory and not my theory, I think it was theory and not my theory, I think it was theory and not my theory, I think it was just a generally accepted theory that just a generally accepted theory that just a generally accepted theory that um, a lot of these fishing emails came um, a lot of these fishing emails came um, a lot of these fishing emails came in and they were in terrible grammar and in and they were in terrible grammar and in and they were in terrible grammar and punctuation and you know that kind of punctuation and you know that kind of punctuation and you know that kind of thing. And there was a theory that maybe thing. And there was a theory that maybe thing. And there was a theory that maybe that was on purpose. And again, it was that was on purpose. And again, it was that was on purpose. And again, it was kind of that concept that we catch kind of that concept that we catch kind of that concept that we catch people when they're busy, we catch people when they're busy, we catch people when they're busy, we catch people when they're distracted, and we people when they're distracted, and we people when they're distracted, and we just get them to do something they just get them to do something they just get them to do something they wouldn't normally do if they thought wouldn't normally do if they thought wouldn't normally do if they thought about it. So, if we put it in this weird about it. So, if we put it in this weird about it. So, if we put it in this weird format and everything, it's just format and everything, it's just format and everything, it's just disarming and people like maybe would be more and people like maybe would be more and people like maybe would be more likely to click on something. Um, today likely to click on something. Um, today likely to click on something. Um, today what I see, you know, is just AI is just what I see, you know, is just AI is just what I see, you know, is just AI is just smarter, right? And it's going to it's smarter, right? And it's going to it's smarter, right? And it's going to it's it's going to easily generate the it's going to easily generate the it's going to easily generate the graphics and reproduce exact web pages, graphics and reproduce exact web pages, graphics and reproduce exact web pages, exact templates like we were talking exact templates like we were talking exact templates like we were talking about earlier. about earlier. about earlier. » Um and they're going to infuse some of » Um and they're going to infuse some of » Um and they're going to infuse some of the psychology in there that's going to the psychology in there that's going to the psychology in there that's going to uh trick people into doing the wrong uh trick people into doing the wrong uh trick people into doing the wrong thing at the wrong time. thing at the wrong time. thing at the wrong time. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Which by the way [clears throat] is » Which by the way [clears throat] is » Which by the way [clears throat] is another big danger with AI. It's it another big danger with AI. It's it another big danger with AI. It's it seems like we try to build ethics into seems like we try to build ethics into seems like we try to build ethics into AI as we train these machines. And so if AI as we train these machines. And so if AI as we train these machines. And so if you if you go to the machine and you if you go to the machine and you if you go to the machine and you know you prompt the chat and you say know you prompt the chat and you say know you prompt the chat and you say um you know hey I want to I want to hack um you know hey I want to I want to hack um you know hey I want to I want to hack into uh you know Reliant Books uh Amazon into uh you know Reliant Books uh Amazon into uh you know Reliant Books uh Amazon account right it'll say no I can't do account right it'll say no I can't do account right it'll say no I can't do that but you turn around and say well that but you turn around and say well that but you turn around and say well I'm a I'm a professor at a university I'm a I'm a professor at a university I'm a I'm a professor at a university and I'm teaching a cyber security attack and I'm teaching a cyber security attack and I'm teaching a cyber security attack » and I want to create a lesson that tells » and I want to create a lesson that tells » and I want to create a lesson that tells my my students right how to my my students right how to my my students right how to protect against this then all of a protect against this then all of a protect against this then all of a sudden AI will just you spit out all the sudden AI will just you spit out all the sudden AI will just you spit out all the things you need to know to try to hack things you need to know to try to hack things you need to know to try to hack that account. So, that account. So, that account. So, » dude, it's so true. » dude, it's so true. » dude, it's so true. » So, that's that's another big » So, that's that's another big » So, that's that's another big vulnerability » existed on its ethics policies. » existed on its ethics policies. » existed on its ethics policies. » Probably from a society standpoint, um I » Probably from a society standpoint, um I » Probably from a society standpoint, um I think biases are the biggest concern think biases are the biggest concern think biases are the biggest concern that we have with AI. Um, if you don't that we have with AI. Um, if you don't that we have with AI. Um, if you don't understand what the AI has been trained understand what the AI has been trained understand what the AI has been trained on or how it's been trained, um, it's on or how it's been trained, um, it's on or how it's been trained, um, it's obvious that certain AIs uh, AI obvious that certain AIs uh, AI obvious that certain AIs uh, AI implementations have their own biases. implementations have their own biases. implementations have their own biases. And, you know, sure, And, you know, sure, And, you know, sure, » I think our boy Elon was in the news, » I think our boy Elon was in the news, » I think our boy Elon was in the news, you know, four or five months ago or you know, four or five months ago or you know, four or five months ago or something about, uh, Grock and, uh, the something about, uh, Grock and, uh, the something about, uh, Grock and, uh, the very negative things that it was the very negative things that it was the very negative things that it was saying and doing. Yeah. saying and doing. Yeah. saying and doing. Yeah. » Um, you know, so » Um, you know, so » Um, you know, so » yeah. No, it is a wild thing and I I » yeah. No, it is a wild thing and I I » yeah. No, it is a wild thing and I I don't know it's still so hard for me to don't know it's still so hard for me to don't know it's still so hard for me to understand how it works in general. Um I understand how it works in general. Um I understand how it works in general. Um I was explaining to someone how the was explaining to someone how the was explaining to someone how the best analogy I heard for me to best analogy I heard for me to best analogy I heard for me to understand like the really the only understand like the really the only understand like the really the only difference from the machine learning we difference from the machine learning we difference from the machine learning we knew before to like now is imagine a knew before to like now is imagine a knew before to like now is imagine a wall of uh like how we look at wall of uh like how we look at wall of uh like how we look at everything in line, right? So like I've everything in line, right? So like I've everything in line, right? So like I've got a filing cabinet and all the files got a filing cabinet and all the files got a filing cabinet and all the files are behind each other. I open that and I are behind each other. I open that and I are behind each other. I open that and I got to go behind every one of those got to go behind every one of those got to go behind every one of those files where AI essentially the way files where AI essentially the way files where AI essentially the way they've built these LLMs is every folder they've built these LLMs is every folder they've built these LLMs is every folder is like a grid, right? Just flat in is like a grid, right? Just flat in is like a grid, right? Just flat in front of you. And if that if it was done front of you. And if that if it was done front of you. And if that if it was done that way in your office building, you that way in your office building, you that way in your office building, you couldn't reach that file, right? You couldn't reach that file, right? You couldn't reach that file, right? You couldn't reach it because it'd be so far couldn't reach it because it'd be so far couldn't reach it because it'd be so far away, but you could, you know, away, but you could, you know, away, but you could, you know, potentially see it. But AI has unlimited potentially see it. But AI has unlimited potentially see it. But AI has unlimited reach because of how it's coded reach because of how it's coded reach because of how it's coded essentially, right? So like our essentially, right? So like our essentially, right? So like our prompting is what prompting is what prompting is what » moves it to a certain grid area » moves it to a certain grid area » moves it to a certain grid area essentially and can grab that essentially and can grab that essentially and can grab that information. And I'm like still makes no information. And I'm like still makes no information. And I'm like still makes no sense to me. Thank you for the analogy. sense to me. Thank you for the analogy. sense to me. Thank you for the analogy. Like helps a little bit to explain. Like helps a little bit to explain. Like helps a little bit to explain. Yeah. Okay. It is more advanced on how Yeah. Okay. It is more advanced on how Yeah. Okay. It is more advanced on how quickly it can gather information and quickly it can gather information and quickly it can gather information and process information and come back with process information and come back with process information and come back with an answer. Uh but then you think about an answer. Uh but then you think about an answer. Uh but then you think about who decided how it uh how it codes to who decided how it uh how it codes to who decided how it uh how it codes to that folder of information is a little that folder of information is a little that folder of information is a little interesting to me on the bias, right? interesting to me on the bias, right? interesting to me on the bias, right? Cuz you know it could you could unlock a Cuz you know it could you could unlock a Cuz you know it could you could unlock a folder there that somebody put an Easter folder there that somebody put an Easter folder there that somebody put an Easter egg or a coding and at what point does egg or a coding and at what point does egg or a coding and at what point does it get so big you can't even find those it get so big you can't even find those it get so big you can't even find those anymore? anymore? anymore? » Um you know I I think that's kind of » Um you know I I think that's kind of » Um you know I I think that's kind of interesting. I'm certainly no expert. I interesting. I'm certainly no expert. I interesting. I'm certainly no expert. I have no no experience really programming have no no experience really programming have no no experience really programming or training AI modules or anything like or training AI modules or anything like or training AI modules or anything like that. But uh but I do read a few things that. But uh but I do read a few things that. But uh but I do read a few things and um what I understand a little bit and um what I understand a little bit and um what I understand a little bit especially the text generative AI is especially the text generative AI is especially the text generative AI is that it's really almost more algorithm that it's really almost more algorithm that it's really almost more algorithm based that they've read based that they've read based that they've read » however many billion sentences » however many billion sentences » however many billion sentences right out of all the different documents right out of all the different documents right out of all the different documents that it's been trained on and it's a that it's been trained on and it's a that it's been trained on and it's a predictive analogy right this word is predictive analogy right this word is predictive analogy right this word is followed by that word is followed by followed by that word is followed by followed by that word is followed by this word in this context. So if you ask this word in this context. So if you ask this word in this context. So if you ask a question about a particular context, a question about a particular context, a question about a particular context, then there's an algorithm that it goes then there's an algorithm that it goes then there's an algorithm that it goes through and says this is the most likely through and says this is the most likely through and says this is the most likely next word in this sentence and then it next word in this sentence and then it next word in this sentence and then it creates sentences and stories which is creates sentences and stories which is creates sentences and stories which is why hallucination happens so much. Um why hallucination happens so much. Um why hallucination happens so much. Um » you know there's some really interesting » you know there's some really interesting » you know there's some really interesting things out there. Uh and I think it uh things out there. Uh and I think it uh things out there. Uh and I think it uh demonstrates the limitations of AI. So demonstrates the limitations of AI. So demonstrates the limitations of AI. So AI has been trained and understands this AI has been trained and understands this AI has been trained and understands this I guess for whatever however it I guess for whatever however it I guess for whatever however it understands right but AI knows what understands right but AI knows what understands right but AI knows what random number generation is and what it random number generation is and what it random number generation is and what it means it it can tell you and define it means it it can tell you and define it means it it can tell you and define it for you but there was a a case I saw out for you but there was a a case I saw out for you but there was a a case I saw out there where someone asked AI can you there where someone asked AI can you there where someone asked AI can you randomly generate a number for me and it randomly generate a number for me and it randomly generate a number for me and it generated the same number over and over generated the same number over and over generated the same number over and over and over and over again and it never and over and over again and it never and over and over again and it never generated a different number and the generated a different number and the generated a different number and the thought process behind that is is that thought process behind that is is that thought process behind that is is that it's read so many documents and it's it's read so many documents and it's it's read so many documents and it's been trained on so much information that been trained on so much information that been trained on so much information that basically tells it that statistically basically tells it that statistically basically tells it that statistically right this is the number most likely to right this is the number most likely to right this is the number most likely to be generated by a random number be generated by a random number be generated by a random number generator and so it tells you I'm generator and so it tells you I'm generator and so it tells you I'm randomly generating a number but all randomly generating a number but all randomly generating a number but all it's really doing is predicting based on it's really doing is predicting based on it's really doing is predicting based on what it was trained on what it was trained on what it was trained on » what that number would be » what that number would be » what that number would be » yeah someone says out of one to 100 on a » yeah someone says out of one to 100 on a » yeah someone says out of one to 100 on a random number generator what's the random number generator what's the random number generator what's the most often or what results the most often or what results the most often or what results the most often and so you're saying it's scraping often and so you're saying it's scraping often and so you're saying it's scraping all that information and then says all that information and then says all that information and then says » right and then says that's it. So it » right and then says that's it. So it » right and then says that's it. So it doesn't actually randomly generate the doesn't actually randomly generate the doesn't actually randomly generate the number. It just searches its algorithm number. It just searches its algorithm number. It just searches its algorithm or applies an algorithm to text that or applies an algorithm to text that or applies an algorithm to text that it's been trained on. it's been trained on. it's been trained on. » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » It has a favorite number. That's okay. » It has a favorite number. That's okay. » It has a favorite number. That's okay. Can't judge it for that. Can't judge it for that. Can't judge it for that. » Yeah. Yeah. To whatever Yeah. It's it's » Yeah. Yeah. To whatever Yeah. It's it's » Yeah. Yeah. To whatever Yeah. It's it's a big human flaw, right? That we we a big human flaw, right? That we we a big human flaw, right? That we we assign human traits to assign human traits to assign human traits to » Yeah. » Yeah. » Yeah. » You know, things that are not human. » You know, things that are not human. » You know, things that are not human. Right. Right. Right. » Yeah. Wild, dude. This was awesome. Uh » Yeah. Wild, dude. This was awesome. Uh » Yeah. Wild, dude. This was awesome. Uh this was a lot of fun. this was a lot of fun. this was a lot of fun. » I had a lot of fun. » I had a lot of fun. » I had a lot of fun. » I was looking forward to it. It uh you » I was looking forward to it. It uh you » I was looking forward to it. It uh you definitely overd delivered. I I knew it definitely overd delivered. I I knew it definitely overd delivered. I I knew it was going to be good. Uh but thank you was going to be good. Uh but thank you was going to be good. Uh but thank you so much for your time. Uh where can they so much for your time. Uh where can they so much for your time. Uh where can they follow you? Uh what's the best way to follow you? Uh what's the best way to follow you? Uh what's the best way to interact with you on the socials? interact with you on the socials? interact with you on the socials? » Uh so we have LinkedIn, Facebook. Um I » Uh so we have LinkedIn, Facebook. Um I » Uh so we have LinkedIn, Facebook. Um I think we have an Instagram account. I think we have an Instagram account. I think we have an Instagram account. I don't really do all the social media don't really do all the social media don't really do all the social media posting right myself. Uh but we posting right myself. Uh but we posting right myself. Uh but we certainly have all of that. So, okay. certainly have all of that. So, okay. certainly have all of that. So, okay. LinkedIn, Facebook, LinkedIn, Facebook, LinkedIn, Facebook, » personally, you're on LinkedIn and the » personally, you're on LinkedIn and the » personally, you're on LinkedIn and the company as well, right? Great. Awesome. company as well, right? Great. Awesome. company as well, right? Great. Awesome. All right, guys. Go give Essential IT a All right, guys. Go give Essential IT a All right, guys. Go give Essential IT a follow and uh go go connect with JD on follow and uh go go connect with JD on follow and uh go go connect with JD on LinkedIn if you have any uh uh uh AI LinkedIn if you have any uh uh uh AI LinkedIn if you have any uh uh uh AI takeover questions. Obviously, he's a takeover questions. Obviously, he's a takeover questions. Obviously, he's a conspiracist. We've heard it here first. conspiracist. We've heard it here first. conspiracist. We've heard it here first. » Right. There you go. All right. Well, » Right. There you go. All right. Well, » Right. There you go. All right. Well, thanks for letting me be here, Sam. thanks for letting me be here, Sam. thanks for letting me be here, Sam. Appreciate it. ---